New Skill: Fly?

[Pielorinho]

Okay, I find the maneuverability rules for flying creatures to be absurdly complicated,and I can never remember how they work, and I still don't understand exactly how many circles a creature with (say) average maneuverability can turn in a single round. They drive me crazy.

I was thinking today: why not introduce a new skill, Fly, that's useable only by creatures with a fly speed? Just like tumbling, it'd have different DCs for different maneuvers, such as:

-Turn 45 degrees in a round: 5
-Turn 90 degrees in a round: 10
-Turn 180 degrees in a round: 15
-Hover: 20
-Fly straight up: 25
-Fly backwards: 30

That sort of thing.

Make it a dex-based skill, useable untrained (if, for example, you find a pair of Boots of Flying or something), and give different spells and items a bonus to the skill as appropriate. Give flying creatures ranks in fly, and you're good to go: by adding in an extra skill, you've streamlined the system by removing a whole subsystem.

Whaddy'all think?

Daniel

 

[Dakkareth]

I think, it's a good idea. The maneuvrability classes should be reflected somehow, though - no matter how good a dragon is at flying, he won't make a 180° turn on the spot, while a person flying via fly could conceivably do it (haven't looked up the specifics of the spell).

Also I'd make the skill dex based for natural flying, but int based for spell-powered flight. It doesn't make much sense to me, that a rogue could control a spell of flying better than a wizard ...

 

[Pielorinho]

I think, it's a good idea. The maneuvrability classes should be reflected somehow, though - no matter how good a dragon is at flying, he won't make a 180° turn on the spot, while a person flying via fly could conceivably do it (haven't looked up the specifics of the spell).

Also I'd make the skill dex based for natural flying, but int based for spell-powered flight. It doesn't make much sense to me, that a rogue could control a spell of flying better than a wizard ...

Interesting ideas! One thing I'd thought of was giving a size bonus/penalty on flying similar to the penalty on hiding; this would make it difficult for dragons to achieve spectacular maneuvers, whereas pixies would still be able to do so, with similar ranks in the skill.

As for basing the spell's skill off of Int, I'm not so sure. First, it doesn't really bother me to think that a rogue is all-round better at moving around; second, it's less complicated. Do you base it off of Cha for a sorcerer and Wis for a cleric? Easier to leave it on Dex, I think, and give a bonus to the skill based on caster level. You can justify it by saying that Dexterity represents your reflexes, which must be sharp in order to execute the more difficult maneuvers.

Daniel

 

[Dakkareth]

Easier to leave it on Dex, I think, and give a bonus to the skill based on caster level. You can justify it by saying that Dexterity represents your reflexes, which must be sharp in order to execute the more difficult maneuvers.

Makes sense to me.

Mmhh, maybe I should create some spell to implement 'mind over matter' concerning movement. Use int/cha bonus instead of dex, increase movement, maybe grant evasion. Needs more thought, though - sorry for the hijack.

 

[Plane Sailing]

I think that one of the big problems with this is that skill ranks are typically tied to HD. How do you prevent dragons having massive skill ranks in fly, while hummingbirds can't even afford 1?

I think you would be better off sticking with the existing manouverability classes and then work out a way of tying them into your DC method that you choose - e.g. class A gets +30 on checks, class B gets +20, class C gets +10, class D gets +0 or something similar.

But I really think it is easier to just use the manouvre classes as they stand.

Cheers

 

[Terwox]

hmm. I'd never even looked at that table.
Yikes.
At least it's generally easily ignored, unless you're having differing sizes of flying monsters/PCs with different flying speeds and classes and... wow, that could get ugly.
My idea would be to stick with the current table (it wouldn't use up skill points, or have the hummingbird/dragon problem,) but just strip it down so it's not nearly so obnoxious.
Maybe equate poor and clumsy, and average and good, and make the turning rules more easily understood. As to HOW, I'm not sure, but I'm not sure if your method would ultimately make more sense -- it would still reference a table, just a table of DC modifiers, and it might get ugly like Shadowrun modifiers or something...

 

[Gez]

Okay, I find the maneuverability rules for flying creatures to be absurdly complicated,and I can never remember how they work, and I still don't understand exactly how many circles a creature with (say) average maneuverability can turn in a single round. They drive me crazy.

I was thinking today: why not introduce a new skill, Fly, that's useable only by creatures with a fly speed? Just like tumbling, it'd have different DCs for different maneuvers, such as:

-Turn 45 degrees in a round: 5
-Turn 90 degrees in a round: 10
-Turn 180 degrees in a round: 15
-Hover: 20
-Fly straight up: 25
-Fly backwards: 30

That sort of thing.

Now, just consider each maneuverability category is equivalent to always succeed on a particular DC or lower, and always fail on higher DCs...

Anyway, I agree with you about streamlining the system even more. It would be the flight equivalent of tumble for ground movement.

 

[Piratecat]

Right now the maneuverability is something I tend to handwave away... "That dragon will be back in a minute. Better do something while you have the chance!" I'm really reticent to add new skills, though, especially when they accomplish something that was previously managed without the expenditure of oh-so-precious skill points.

 

[StAlda]

While a Dragon would have HUGE ranks in Fly, they would also have HUGE penalties for being....well, HUGE. A Hummingbird can have an inate Fly rank of 15, plus they would have bonuses for their small size.

I think this approach totally fits D20 in a big way. I am going work on this one.

 

[Saeviomagy]

The current system does exactly what daniel wants, only without rolls.

I really fail to see how adding rolls to it will simplify it.