No ECL in the SRD. Why are d20 publishers able to use it?
- Thread starter Zub
- Start date
The Sigil
Mr. 3000 (Words per post)
My guess is that it's probably the same reason some companies have been able to put out Beholder and Mind Flayer products...
They asked. If you get permission from WotC to use it, whether it's in the SRD or not, you can use it. You may not be able to declare it OGC, but you can use it.
Remember, the OGL does not trump copyright law - it simply says, "without you needing to ask, here are copyrighted things we give you permission to use, provided you stick to certain guidelines (the OGL)." If you want to use other copyrighted material, you can still ask for permission as normal.
In fact, you could conceivably publish a book full of stuff that had been published elsewhere as OGC without using the OGL - you'd just have to get explicit permission from every person who held the original copyright to begin with.
To sum up...
You can't copy copyrighted material and publish it unless you have permission from the copyright owner.
The OGL is one form of "blanket permission" so you don't have to ask on a case-by-case basis.
Whether or not something is OGC, you can always ask for permission - and doing so does not violate the OGL (unless you declare it as OGC when you're not supposed to).
--The Sigil
They asked. If you get permission from WotC to use it, whether it's in the SRD or not, you can use it. You may not be able to declare it OGC, but you can use it.
Remember, the OGL does not trump copyright law - it simply says, "without you needing to ask, here are copyrighted things we give you permission to use, provided you stick to certain guidelines (the OGL)." If you want to use other copyrighted material, you can still ask for permission as normal.
In fact, you could conceivably publish a book full of stuff that had been published elsewhere as OGC without using the OGL - you'd just have to get explicit permission from every person who held the original copyright to begin with.
To sum up...
You can't copy copyrighted material and publish it unless you have permission from the copyright owner.
The OGL is one form of "blanket permission" so you don't have to ask on a case-by-case basis.
Whether or not something is OGC, you can always ask for permission - and doing so does not violate the OGL (unless you declare it as OGC when you're not supposed to).
--The Sigil
Last edited:
Flyspeck23
First Post
I can't imagine that WotC would give permission on a regular basis (if the would, they'd made it part of the SRD).
Most likely nobody noticed - neither WotC nor the other publishers who used ECL. And, frankly, I don't think WotC does care at all.
Nevertheless, I was a little bit surprised to see that ECL is in fact not part of the SRD (or at least I can't find it
).
That "Mind Flayer product" mentioned earlier was a special case, as far as I know. The product was finished (written or printed, I don't know) before the Mind Flayers was dropped out of the SRD. Because of that WotC made an exception, not because Paradigm Concept asked nicely (BTW, great book!).
Most likely nobody noticed - neither WotC nor the other publishers who used ECL. And, frankly, I don't think WotC does care at all.
Nevertheless, I was a little bit surprised to see that ECL is in fact not part of the SRD (or at least I can't find it
).That "Mind Flayer product" mentioned earlier was a special case, as far as I know. The product was finished (written or printed, I don't know) before the Mind Flayers was dropped out of the SRD. Because of that WotC made an exception, not because Paradigm Concept asked nicely (BTW, great book!).
Aitch Eye
First Post
The notes in the margins of pages 220 and 221 of Monster Manual II say "The game text on pages 220 and 221 is considered Open Game Content." The final paragraph of page 221 is: "A Scorpionfolk PC's effective character level (ECL) is equal to its class level +16. Thus, a 1st-level scorpionfolk ranger has an ECL of 17 and is the equivalent of a 17th-level character."
Aside from putting out the term as OGC, the example pretty much explains the mechanic, and would seem to make it OGC as well.
Aside from putting out the term as OGC, the example pretty much explains the mechanic, and would seem to make it OGC as well.
trancejeremy
Adventurer
Well, actually, if you read carefully, it doesn't use ECL, but something similar.
They say "Level Equivalent"
They use the concept, but not the specifics.
They say "Level Equivalent"
They use the concept, but not the specifics.
jmucchiello
Hero
I pointed this out nearly a year ago. No one cared then, no one cares now. The gaffe in the MM2 puts ECL into OGC so it is no longer a problem. I do not make reference to ECL in my products.
trancejeremy
Adventurer
Aitch Eye said:I suppose most people will be able to work this out for themselves, but based on past seemingly obvious misundertandings I've seen on the boards, I'll point out that Trancejeremy was apparently referring to the FFG book, and not me doctoring the quote from MMII.
Yeah, I was talking about Galactic Races, I was just replying to the original poster, and hadn't even read the later posts, so didn't think to hit the quote button. Sorry.
Anyway, Traveller 20 sort of does the same thing with VP/WP, which isn't open content. They use an alternate system that is quite close to it - called Lifeblood and Stamina. (OTOH, AEG got permission to use the VP/WP system)
Darrin Drader
Explorer
I think the real question here is why would WotC care? The only thing ECL does is adjust the level of a character from a non-standard race. How does it hurt them for other companies to publish character races that are non-standard? If anything, it helps sell more copies of books such as Savage Species or Races of Faerun. ECL isn't like the mind flayer or the beholder. It doesn't separate their IP from that of others. It's just another mechanic, and one that is seeing more and more use the farther we get away from the classic D&D racial model of humans, elves, dwarves, and halflings.
Similar Threads
