No iterative attacks with natural weapons?

[Coredump]

Hey, am I missing something? Or did the D&D FAQ disagree with KR??

So, if a creature normally attacks with claw/claw/bite (multi-attack feat) but only has a +4 base melee attack, than that means only one grapple attack?
This does differ from what KR said. (I think ;-)

.

 

[kreynolds]

Or did the D&D FAQ disagree with KR??

It's quite possible and it appears so. How very strange. That actually makes no sense.

If you are a 1st level fighter, you can make two grapple attempts in a round, one with your primary hand and one with your off-hand. But if you're a monster with 2 claw attacks at +4, you only get to make one attempt? Fishy.

 

[Saeviomagy]

Ki Ryn - the mindflayer has improved grab, so whenever it attacks with a tentacle, it automatically attempts to grapple. Hence it gets 4 grapple attempts in a round just by making normal attacks. Since most creatures which I could imaging grabbing people are equipped with improved grab, I don't really have a problem with this ruling.

Without that ruling, it would be perfectly possible for a horse to get 3 grapple attempts in a round - something which doesn't really sit well with me.

 

[kreynolds]

Ki Ryn - the mindflayer has improved grab, so whenever it attacks with a tentacle, it automatically attempts to grapple. Hence it gets 4 grapple attempts in a round just by making normal attacks. Since most creatures which I could imaging grabbing people are equipped with improved grab, I don't really have a problem with this ruling.

The FAQ contradicts both your opinion and mine as well.

 

[Caliban]

The FAQ contradicts both your opinion and mine as well.

From the FAQ:

Note that creatures with the improved grab special attack can use their natural weapons in a grapple.

 

[kreynolds]

Note that creatures with the improved grab special attack can use their natural weapons in a grapple.

I thought that was to point out that creatures with improved grab could use their natural weapons for attacks during a grapple or to aid their grapple attempt. It said in a grapple, not to start a grapple. Damn, this is wierd.

 

[Caliban]

I thought that was to point out that creatures with improved grab could use their natural weapons for attacks during a grapple or to aid their grapple attempt. It said in a grapple, not to start a grapple. Damn, this is wierd.

From the SRD:

IMPROVED GRAB

If the creature hits with a melee weapon (usually a claw or bite attack), it deals normal damage and attempts to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. No initial touch attack is required, and Tiny and Small creatures do not suffer a special size penalty. Unless otherwise stated, improved grab works only against opponents at least one size category smaller than the creature. The creature has the option to conduct the grapple normally, or simply use the part of its body it used in the improved grab to hold the opponent. If it chooses to do the latter, it suffers a -20 penalty to grapple checks, but is not considered grappled itself; the creature does not lose its Dexterity bonus to AC, still threatens an area, and can use its remaining attacks against other opponents.

A successful hold does not deal any additional damage unless the creature also has the constrict ability. If the creature does not constrict, each successful grapple check it makes during successive rounds automatically deals the damage listed for the attack that established the hold. Otherwise, it deals constriction damage as well (the amount is listed in the creature’s descriptive text).

The Improved Grab ability itself states that any natural weapon attack that hits allows a grapple check as a free action.

 

[kreynolds]

The Improved Grab ability itself states that any natural weapon attack that hits allows a grapple check as a free action.

I see. Still wierd, but the rule is clear now. Thanks Russ.

 

[ConcreteBuddha]

What do I do with a silly little creature like a level 5 Barbarian lizardfolk (+6 BAB, Multiattack)?

Is it:

Two Greatclub attacks (+6/+1) and a Bite attack (+4)?

or

One Greatclub attack (+6) and a Bite attack (+4)?



Your almighty wisdom would be appreciated.


Also, a source would be nice as well...

 

[Destil]

What do I do with a silly little creature like a level 5 Barbarian lizardfolk (+6 BAB, Multiattack)?

Is it:

Two Greatclub attacks (+6/+1) and a Bite attack (+4)?

or

One Greatclub attack (+6) and a Bite attack (+4)?



Your almighty wisdom would be appreciated.


Also, a source would be nice as well...

The bite attack can be used as an "off hand" attack, like attacks with armor spikes. Multiattack is effectivly the equivelent of Two Weapon Fighting for natural attacks. Thus it has the following options:

+4/-1 club attacks with a +4 bite (-2 penelity to all attacks, including AoO during the round, for using two weapons)
+6/+1 club attacks
And also have the option of his natural attack sequence-
+6/+6 Claw / +4 Bite

He would get 1/2 his Str bonus to damage for the bite... Not sure about the club, I could see either x1.5 or x1

EDIT: Upon reviewing it further I realised the Multiattack feat replaces Abmidextarity, not Two Weapon Fighting. So if the lizard had TWF they could use the above numbers, otherswise they still have a -4 penelity to all attacks, so:
+0/-3 Club / +0 Bite
+6/+1 Club
+6/+6 Claw / +4 bite