No love for Oathbound?

Thanks for the reply, Teneb.

Funny thing is I'm reading through more of my Oathbound book these last few days in response to this thread, and rediscovering the things I enjoy about the product! Oathbound really does have an interesting background and personality behind it. Sorry, I'm really not a PDF guy. But don't worry, I'll be sure to look through other Oathbound books during my next visit to the store ;)

Cheers.
 

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To Bastion

I am not sure I have seen any baseless criticisms in this thread. Most people just stated their opinion of the setting and why they chose not to use it. I have thought about buying the setting a few times, but it just was not for me. The cover art is a draw, and that got me to look at the book.

The reason I have never picked it up is because of the one size fits all and everything allowed approach. I have always thought that what made a setting unique are the restrictions found within the bounds of the worlds. Personally, I prefer the less equals more method of campaign design and huge numbers of new races are a real turn off.

In any event, I do think Bastion has been defensive in this thread. It shows that you really care about the world and that is great, but 3-4 people posting rebuttals to what seems to be largely posts about preference and opinion seems to be going a bit overboard.
 

Actually, that is why I posted to this thread. It wasn't to criticise Bastion's product or the art, but more to respond to what I perceived to be Bastion disregarding the opinions of their customers.

Also, because I thought Oathbound had a lot of potential, even though I haven't really used it, got me thinking WHY haven't I used it, or bought more? And I thought this information might be useful to Bastion for future marketing or product development.

To be fair, there are a vast number of reasons which factor into why I purchase or pass over a product. The relentless release of new products by a vast number of d20 companies at the time (this seems to have slowed somewhat since) makes competing for the gamer dollar very competitive indeed. I guess it came down to justifying every purchase I made, and weighing them up against the alternatives.

There are a variety of things that make me pick up a gaming book .. not in any particular order 1) good reviews; 2) reputation of the company; 3) already have other products in the same line; 4) cover art jumps out at you!

A couple of weeks ago, the guy behind the counter of my FLGS complained I had completely passed over a new product without even a second glance. It was a soft-bound book, the cover art was very non-descript, and even the title was not very prominent. I had to admit, I thought it was a supplement to some game I hadn't heard of.

So, after his complaint, I thought I'd pick it up and have a look. It was actually a brand new campaign setting. The more I read, the more interesting it looked. If I recall, it was kind of steam-punky post-apocalypse earth with demonic invasion and earth had gone all neo-religious right in response. It was a great setting and I'm glad I was convinced to pick it up. I bought it on the spot. But for the life of me, I still can't remember what the game was called?

Though important, cover art, or indeed, interior art, alone aren't enough to sell a book. The rules / editing must be solid, and conform to d20 standards. This is one reason I shy away from OGL products in favour of d20 products. I want to ensure that if I want to lift aspects from one product and drop them into another, they will work without too much difficulty. This is not true of all OGL products.

Though a fascinating setting, Monte Cooke's Arcana Unearthed strays a little too far from d20 to be immediately useful in my games. It might be great for a self-contained campaign, but then content from other d20 products aren't going to drop into it without editing either.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trashing AU, in fact I think it's very good. But I also think it has a specific audience, that being people seeking something alternative from their d20 games. Though I also think if left unchecked, if different alternate d20 spin-offs gain enough popularity, there is a danger of fragmenting the market, which becomes detrimental to the goal of having a common rules system.

EverQuest RPG was another example of OGL gone wrong. I bought the EverQuest Players book, but soon realised there were just too many things that were changed for no apparently good reason .. change for the sake of change .. I would no longer be playing familiar d20, but something else. You couldn't mix with characters from other sources, because the magic system was different, and the characters were overpowered. I severely regret I ever made that purchase, and vowed not only to never to buy another book in the EverQuest line again, but made me wary of the products of every other d20 publisher on the market.

There are a variety of reasons why a company may choose to go OGL instead of d20. Being able to display nipples in their artwork, for example :p However, the most common reason for going OGL appears to be for straying from the d20 system, or taking the rules in a new direction. This isn't always a bad thing .. but it can often be so.

I should mention that the above comments aren't directed at Bastion Press products. I'm merely elaborating on reasons I have for buying or not buying products .. anyone's product.

I notice Bastion Press mention in another thread that they're bringing out a new OGL campaign. I really hope that Bastion bring out a great product, and don't repeat the same mistakes I feel a lot of other companies have made with OGL.
 
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BelenUmeria said:
The reason I have never picked it up is because of the one size fits all and everything allowed approach. I have always thought that what made a setting unique are the restrictions found within the bounds of the worlds. Personally, I prefer the less equals more method of campaign design and huge numbers of new races are a real turn off.

Hi BelenUmeria. When I first started reading Oathbound, I too was wary of the "one size fits all" approach. It just seemed a little too contrived. However, I must say, that reading further, I realise pulling characters in from other worlds is built thoroughly into the campaign background, and is the setting's prime motivator. In brief, seven god-like beings are trapped in this world, and attempt to attract and encourage powerful adventurers in the hope that might break free!

I also like the new races, because they represent beings are pulled from all manner of worlds. Some people have expressed a disliking for the "furry" nature of many of the races. However, I think this helps to differentiate them from the more standard elves, dwarves, half-orcs etc familiar to other worlds, and perhaps are better reflect the geographic, wilderness and aquatic nature of many of Oathbound's locations.

As far as the setting being unique, and having it's own bounds, I think if you read further, there is much to make Oathbound unique. The world is separated into seven distinct realms. Each realm is ruled by a different domain lord, has uniquely different geographic features and other characteristics which add both flavour and challenge to each realm.

As GM, you set the restrictions as far which characters are encountered or allowed. The Forge does not have to be swarming with Warforged, Drow and Kender, and it does not have to resemble Sigil. I realise that Oathbound includes Elves, Dwarves and other standard races; however, it doesn't have to. Oathbound is populated by enough races unique to the world, that you character may be the only Dwarf you ever meet, your armour may have to be custom-fit, and you're challenged by cultures and races totally alien to you on a daily basis. I think you'll find any number of restrictions giving Oathbound it's own uniqueness.
 
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You've hit it right on the money, DarkWhite. Oathbound is unique because you don't have to use the included races. You can stick to standard races, use only Oathbound ones, or use a combination. There is a lot of flexibility there because it is so alien. I know of gamers who use d20 Modern rules and characters in Oathbound creating more of a cyberpunk feel to it. It's this fluidic quality that is one of the real strengths of Oathbound.

The Seven Bound Ones all have an agenda and that's to find the One who is good enough and powerful enough to defeat them in combat and take their place as the bound god's jailers. This is the hook that draws people to play Oathbound. What player doesn't love the chance for his character to become more powerful and get more good stuff? What DM doesn't love to plot behind the players' backs and come up with something that will leave them speechless? Having a player slowly acquire power until he is ready to be faced by Barbello in combat is part of the fun of the setting. Then when the player actually does beat her, imagine seeing his jaw drop when you (the GM) say that his character now rules over Arena and is now subjected to the Oaths of Binding and the god in his charge. Oathbound is a fantastic playground for Rat Bastard DMs of all sorts. :)
 


BradfordFerguson said:
The book your game store had you pick up was Dark Legacies Player's Guide. D20 Filtered has reviewed this and other lesser known books ;)

Thanks for that BradfordFerguson. I know, I could have just checked the cover of the book once I got home from work .. but at least others know about it too now ;)

One of the things I found interesting about Dark Legacies was how Religious fanaticism has engulfed the world as response to the demonic invasion. Factoring in the corruption and oppression institutionalised in such a society makes for some very dark adventuring. I figure aspects of this game could very easily be mixed and matched with other ironpunk settings like Privateer Press' Iron Kingdoms setting (Witchfire Trilogy), or others.

This gets back to why adherence to d20 standards is so important. If products such as Dark Legacies and Iron Kingdoms strayed too much from d20 norms, it would be much more difficult to mix and match them. When I purchase products, I often weigh up how such a product can add value to products I already own. Time spent converting thing to fit, such as Spells from a different spell system, or toning down Races or Feats that suffer from power creep, this is time I'd rather be spending on putting a good adventure together!
 

Dark Legacies has some really interesting elements that can be used quite easily in Oathbound, especially by using the religious slant as a faction for a Bloodlord in Penance or a Warlord in Arena.
 

Great to hear some people combining Dark Legacies with Oathbound. I've had only positive experiences with Bastion Press products and with Bastion Press people. :) We've recommended Torn Assunder: Critical Hits for use with Dark legacies so there's no reason there can't be more crossover. Anyways, back to the topic at hand. Cheers.
 

BastionPress_Creech said:
You've hit it right on the money, DarkWhite. Oathbound is unique because you don't have to use the included races. You can stick to standard races, use only Oathbound ones, or use a combination.

Or use neither set and adopt new races from various monster books.

The reason I am bumping this thread has to do with prestige races. It looks like they are getting a major rehaul:

http://www.oathbound.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=23&forum=5&post_id=546#forumpost546

And Wildwood's TOC that was posted on OB's messageboard:

Here's the TOC for Wildwood as well as the page count. It's important to remember that this is my Word page count based upon the manuscript. When art is added, the page counts will change.

Product Summary- 1 page
Chapter 1- Intro to the Forge (Wildwood is also a stand-alone campaign setting so this chapter provides a brief glimpse of the Forge.) It also updates the races to 3.5 and adds racial levels for the more common ones, such as asherake, dover, faust, frey, wild frey, nightling and thorn.
Page count: 12

Chapter 2- Overview of Wildwood: Broad overview of the domain from a geographical, political, social and economic standpoint.
Page count: 16

Chapter 3- Ecology of Wildwood: Self-explanatory
Page count: 8

Chapter 4: Taming of the Wilderness: Describes the largest settlements within Wildwood.
Page count: 14

Chapter 5: Forbidden Wilderness: This section describes various wilderness locales spread throughout the domain.
Page count: 22

Chapter 6: Predators: This section describes the domain's most powerful inhabitants.
Page count: 30

Chapter 7: Lost Civilization: This section describes ruined civilizations found throughout Wildwood.
Page count: 12

Chapter 8: Bounty of the Sea: The rivers, lakes and oceans are discussed in this chapter. Broad overviews are given for the oceans.
Page count: 6

Chapter 9: The Thrill of the Hunt: This chapter discusses the importance of the hunt amongst humanoid and non-humanoid socieities. It also provides rules for adjudicating wilderness pursuits, new feats, skills and equipment.
Page count: 12

Chapter 10: The Breadth of Life: This chapter introduces 5 new races as well as gifts. There are also prestige races; however the prestige race mechanic has been drastically changed. It is no longer an xp-based system.
Page count: 26

Chapter 11-Symbiots: This chapter introduces the concept of grafting tissue from one living being to another. (This may be released as a web-enhancement if space is needed)
Page count: 12

Chapter 12-Adventure: Self-explanatory
Page count: 15

Appendix A: Stats for adventure NPC's
Page count: 4

Appendix B: Core and Prestige Classes: There is one new core class and three new prestige classes
Page count: 10

Appendix C: Spells and Magic Items
Page count: 8

Appendix D: Monsters
Page count: 12

There are no new channeling classes in Wildwood. The Oathbound Player's Guide will have six channeling classes including the stormbringers and vagabonds. The channeling mechanic has also been updated and modified.
*********
Note that Wildwood has been written as both a standalone and a domain setting. Just looking at the TOC is making me drool.
 

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