No love for the stupid wizard?
- Thread starter Numion
- Start date
StreamOfTheSky
Adventurer
ha ha, the first thing I thought when I saw the title was that it was a parody of the "No love for the smart fighter?" thread: http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=176982
I guess Numion's actually somewhere between half- and fully-serious about this.
I guess Numion's actually somewhere between half- and fully-serious about this.
Agent Oracle
First Post
Numion said:Expert doesn't fit the concept. The dude is a wizard - he's spent all his time learning spells, so he's not supposed to have a lot of skills. And the experts HD is too much, this is supposed to be a frail wizard
Except you're telling us he's too dumb to LEARN the magic. he doesn't even have the INT necessary to cast 0th level spells. SO... he's really, really not learning them. he's more or less, staring, blankly, at a textbook, then wandering off and getting pissed at the bar.
Just like my freshman year!
Nyeshet
First Post
Personally, I think there should be a rule about reading - specifically that a PC with an Int lower than 8 cannot read unless they insist upon using 1 skill rank for learning the language (as with barbarians, but for a PC with a negative Int mod potentially far more costly). For a more realistic approach, languages should be made into normal skills.
If languages were skills (with the home region language - or Common, if you prefer) having a +8 competence bonus to speech and a +4 competence bonus to literacy (Barbarians having a -4 compentence penalty, thus resulting in a net competence for literacy of 0), and requiring numerous ranks like ordinary skills, then I would suggest that every point below 10 place an automatic extra -1 incompetence penalty to literacy and every 2 points below 10 place an automatic extra -1 incompetence penalty to speech. Add to that a ruling that - outside of the Int modifier, if modifier result in 0 or negative for the speech or literacy, and if the PC has no ranks in the skill, then they cannot make use of it.
Then the Int 6 PC would have a net 0 modifier for literacy (and, even if they were allowed to attempt reading, a -2 to their roll after the Int mod was applied), and only a +4 added to their roll when making Speech checks (+8 (comp) -2 (incomp) -2 (Int)). This would more closely approximate the extreme difficulty in communication one of that low level of Int would and should have.
If languages were skills (with the home region language - or Common, if you prefer) having a +8 competence bonus to speech and a +4 competence bonus to literacy (Barbarians having a -4 compentence penalty, thus resulting in a net competence for literacy of 0), and requiring numerous ranks like ordinary skills, then I would suggest that every point below 10 place an automatic extra -1 incompetence penalty to literacy and every 2 points below 10 place an automatic extra -1 incompetence penalty to speech. Add to that a ruling that - outside of the Int modifier, if modifier result in 0 or negative for the speech or literacy, and if the PC has no ranks in the skill, then they cannot make use of it.
Then the Int 6 PC would have a net 0 modifier for literacy (and, even if they were allowed to attempt reading, a -2 to their roll after the Int mod was applied), and only a +4 added to their roll when making Speech checks (+8 (comp) -2 (incomp) -2 (Int)). This would more closely approximate the extreme difficulty in communication one of that low level of Int would and should have.
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Why does this just scream "Monty Python"? Since our 6-int wizard, we'll call him Thag, will need to be very selective in applying his 1 skill rank per level, and Concentration is one of the most useful non-Int-based skills, it would make sense for him to max it out. I can picture it now ...
...
(camera fades in to a sunny field surrounded by trees. Three dirty and bloody warriors [Bob, Dave, and Chuck] battle against half a dozen fearsome orcs. The sound of swords clanging fills the air, and the sun glints off their weapons. Off to the side, seemingly ignored, is a tall, dim-looking man holding his temples and staring intently at the battle.)
Bob the Fighter: Thag, get in here. We're outnumbered and need you.
(The battle continues for several moments. One of the orcs is slain, but then Dave is shield-smashed in the face and reels back with a broken and bloody nose. Thag continues staring and doesn't seem to hear Bob)
Bob the Fighter (yelling): Thag! Thag! Do something! Dave needs your help!
(Thag remains motionless, staring. Dave takes a fearsome axe chop in his back and goes down.)
Bob the Fighter (screaming now): THAG! Please, for the love of god, DO SOMETHING!
(Thag apparently doesn't hear Bob and continues staring, holding his temples, veins popping out of his forehead from concentration. Several more moments go by while Bob and Chuck drop three more orcs. The remaining two flee into the woods. Dave is motionless on the ground and apparently dead. Bob approaches Thag.)
Bob the Fighter: Thag, hey Thag.
(There's no response from Thag.)
Bob the Fighter (waving arms): Thag! THAG!
(Thag's concentration is so fearsome that beads of sweat are trickling down his forehead. He doesn't acknowledge Bob. Bob punches Thag.)
Thag: Oh. Oooh. Ouch.
Bob the Fighter: Thag. Snap out of it. It's over.
Thag: It's over?
Bob: Yeah. Thag... about your spells.
Thag: Yeah?
Bob: Nothing happened.
Thag: Nothing happened?
Bob: Right.
Thag: Oh. Well, maybe next time.
Bob: Yeah.
Thag: Yeah.
Bob: It's too bad about Dave, though. Well, let's loot the bodies! Adventure ho!
...
(camera fades in to a sunny field surrounded by trees. Three dirty and bloody warriors [Bob, Dave, and Chuck] battle against half a dozen fearsome orcs. The sound of swords clanging fills the air, and the sun glints off their weapons. Off to the side, seemingly ignored, is a tall, dim-looking man holding his temples and staring intently at the battle.)
Bob the Fighter: Thag, get in here. We're outnumbered and need you.
(The battle continues for several moments. One of the orcs is slain, but then Dave is shield-smashed in the face and reels back with a broken and bloody nose. Thag continues staring and doesn't seem to hear Bob)
Bob the Fighter (yelling): Thag! Thag! Do something! Dave needs your help!
(Thag remains motionless, staring. Dave takes a fearsome axe chop in his back and goes down.)
Bob the Fighter (screaming now): THAG! Please, for the love of god, DO SOMETHING!
(Thag apparently doesn't hear Bob and continues staring, holding his temples, veins popping out of his forehead from concentration. Several more moments go by while Bob and Chuck drop three more orcs. The remaining two flee into the woods. Dave is motionless on the ground and apparently dead. Bob approaches Thag.)
Bob the Fighter: Thag, hey Thag.
(There's no response from Thag.)
Bob the Fighter (waving arms): Thag! THAG!
(Thag's concentration is so fearsome that beads of sweat are trickling down his forehead. He doesn't acknowledge Bob. Bob punches Thag.)
Thag: Oh. Oooh. Ouch.
Bob the Fighter: Thag. Snap out of it. It's over.
Thag: It's over?
Bob: Yeah. Thag... about your spells.
Thag: Yeah?
Bob: Nothing happened.
Thag: Nothing happened?
Bob: Right.
Thag: Oh. Well, maybe next time.
Bob: Yeah.
Thag: Yeah.
Bob: It's too bad about Dave, though. Well, let's loot the bodies! Adventure ho!
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Rel
Liquid Awesome
Schmoe said:
The first guy to ever play Thag decided that elvish was the same as French. So when he went into battle he would "cast spells" while he layed about with his "staff".
"Zut alors! Le Fromage Bleu! Oui, Oui!"
I even included some of his sayings in the "roleplaying guide" section of the character sheet.
Vraille Darkfang
First Post
Despite what others are saying...
This sounds like a really cool idea.
Maybe.
Make sure you are playing in a Role-Playing Intense game where sub-optimal characters are the Norm (and the DM UNDERSTANDS that). More than once, I've had to play a min-maxed something or other due to the DM wanting "More Roleplaying", yet 1d6 Trolls are Level 3.
As for a background.
You could be the nephew or 2nd, 3rd, etc, son of a minor noble. While the 1st son serves as successor, the other kids all got to do something else.
Maybe the 2nd (3rd, whatever order you want) son's expectation to go to a certain Wizard's School. Whether that is where his best talents lie or not.
So, you get packed off to Wizard School. Dumb as a Brick, but Daddy pays a lot of money to the school.
So they train you. Waste of time, but the do it as long as the tuition is paid.
Thus you are a Level 1 Wizard. You have 1d4 Hit Points, 4 Skill Points, No real Armor of Weapon Proficiencies to speak of.
And you can't cast a Cantrip to Save your life (quite literally).
If COULD (depending on game) make for an interesting character.
I'd Multiclass into Sorcerer, Rogue or something else pretty quick.
But as characters go...
I'd not allow it in 90% of the games I run; Only about 10% of the time does my DM style stress interaction and story over CR and Initiative.
Talk it over with your DM, even if the character won't fly this game, maybe the next.
This sounds like a really cool idea.
Maybe.
Make sure you are playing in a Role-Playing Intense game where sub-optimal characters are the Norm (and the DM UNDERSTANDS that). More than once, I've had to play a min-maxed something or other due to the DM wanting "More Roleplaying", yet 1d6 Trolls are Level 3.
As for a background.
You could be the nephew or 2nd, 3rd, etc, son of a minor noble. While the 1st son serves as successor, the other kids all got to do something else.
Maybe the 2nd (3rd, whatever order you want) son's expectation to go to a certain Wizard's School. Whether that is where his best talents lie or not.
So, you get packed off to Wizard School. Dumb as a Brick, but Daddy pays a lot of money to the school.
So they train you. Waste of time, but the do it as long as the tuition is paid.
Thus you are a Level 1 Wizard. You have 1d4 Hit Points, 4 Skill Points, No real Armor of Weapon Proficiencies to speak of.
And you can't cast a Cantrip to Save your life (quite literally).
If COULD (depending on game) make for an interesting character.
I'd Multiclass into Sorcerer, Rogue or something else pretty quick.
But as characters go...
I'd not allow it in 90% of the games I run; Only about 10% of the time does my DM style stress interaction and story over CR and Initiative.
Talk it over with your DM, even if the character won't fly this game, maybe the next.
Hypersmurf
Moderatarrrrh...
I'm seeing a barbarian who thinks he's a powerful wizard, but the only spell in his book is Tenser's Transformation...
-Hyp.
-Hyp.
Lhorgrim
Explorer
He could specialize in the 1/2 spells from an old April issue of Dragon magazine.
Something along the lines of:
Invisibility 1/2
Somatic component: Caster covers eyes wih hands. Verbal component: Caster chants "you can't see me" for the duration of the spell.
Summon swarm 1/2
Material component: 1 picnic lunch in basket. Somatic component: Caster spreads picnic lunch on the ground and prepares to eat.
There was a whole list in the old issue of Dragon, but I can't remember which issue. Some of them were pretty funny.
Something along the lines of:
Invisibility 1/2
Somatic component: Caster covers eyes wih hands. Verbal component: Caster chants "you can't see me" for the duration of the spell.
Summon swarm 1/2
Material component: 1 picnic lunch in basket. Somatic component: Caster spreads picnic lunch on the ground and prepares to eat.
There was a whole list in the old issue of Dragon, but I can't remember which issue. Some of them were pretty funny.
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