D&D 5E Now we know what a Fire Hellion is (minor spoiler)

[Paul Farquhar]

Warhammer has been using a "pay to win" model since the late 1980s. If you don't have the (official, licenced) mini, you can't have that unit in your army.

 

[Stormonu]

Never played any GW/Warhammer games so I personally couldnt say, but yeah I heard they are and always were expensive.

I used to buy the Ral Partha and Arduin minis years ago, then Reaper, WotC's prepainted plastic ones and finally some of the Wizkids grey unpainted packs. Except for Reaper, which some were somewhat expensive compared to the rest, all were reasonably priced. Looking at the prices of Wizkids Icons of the Realms line they are out of their minds, $300-$400 miniatures is insane.

Yeah, the prepainted random minis haven't been too bad in price, but once they started offering things like the $500 Tiamat, the 10" LJN figures, the Githyanki statue and the like it seems they realized there were folks out there that'd pay ridiculous money for these things (guilt myself), and, as they always do they dived into that end of the market to make as much as they can before it collapse around them. The company has always been pump & dump (back to Mageknight and Mechwarrior, at least), just now they're into the collectable side of it. Unfortunately, it seems to be feeding back into the "cheap" mini side of the equation.

 

[R_J_K75]

Yeah, the prepainted random minis haven't been too bad in price, but once they started offering things like the $500 Tiamat, the 10" LJN figures, the Githyanki statue and the like it seems they realized there were folks out there that'd pay ridiculous money for these things (guilt myself), and, as they always do they dived into that end of the market to make as much as they can before it collapse around them. The company has always been pump & dump (back to Mageknight and Mechwarrior, at least), just now they're into the collectable side of it. Unfortunately, it seems to be feeding back into the "cheap" mini side of the equation.

I guess you can't blame any company for trying to maximize profit but its unfortunate if it prices out a portion of your customer base to do so.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Can't beat cutting circles out of a cereal box and illustrating them with felt tip pens.

 

[R_J_K75]

Warhammer has been using a "pay to win" model since the late 1980s. If you don't have the (official, licenced) mini, you can't have that unit in your army.

In the early 2000s when WotC re-introduced Chainmail and I was playing D&D at a game store, about 4 or 5 of us bought some of the minis and put together small armies. We didn't play for very long or invest too much but enough to have decent armies. One guy that played D&D with us wanted to play but couldn't afford the investment and wanted to use tokens or regular random minis. The rest of the group just flat out told him no, so I just went with the consensus. I felt bad for him and thought we could let him borrow minis while we played and photo copy cards so he could play. Another part of me thought why should we have to invest in the game and he would get to play for free. Didn't seem fair to us. So, I can understand GW stance on this, if you can't afford to play then maybe you shouldn't.

 

[LuisCarlos17f]

If something I have learnt with shop-keeper videogames (Titan Shops) is the value of the product is chosen by the client willing to pay it. Althought we were complaining it was too expensive, if somebody pays that prize then the company doesn't worry.

And somebody could buy it to speculate, selling more expensive in the future to some collector.

 

[Sorcerers Apprentice]

Warhammer has been using a "pay to win" model since the late 1980s. If you don't have the (official, licenced) mini, you can't have that unit in your army.

Only if you play at their stores or events though, most gamers will happily play if you use whatever miniatures you want, as long as they look reasonably like what they are supposed to represent.

 

[el-remmen]

One guy that played D&D with us wanted to play but couldn't afford the investment and wanted to use tokens or regular random minis. The rest of the group just flat out told him no, so I just went with the consensus. I felt bad for him and thought we could let him borrow minis while we played and photo copy cards so he could play. Another part of me thought why should we have to invest in the game and he would get to play for free. Didn't seem fair to us. So, I can understand GW stance on this, if you can't afford to play then maybe you shouldn't.

<Looks up from building my Magic the Gathering deck using facsimiles of very rare/OOP cards.> Huh?

 

[R_J_K75]

<Looks up from building my Magic the Gathering deck using facsimiles of very rare/OOP cards.> Huh?

If everyone who is playing is OK with it, then no harm no foul, and Im assuming that you bought cards to build a deck to some extent. The guy who wanted to play Chainmail had nothing, and if I remember correctly there was more to the game than just the minis, a rule book, battle maps and scenarios. I actually think the store owner wasnt cool with us doing that either for copyright reasons, taking business away from his store, and starting a bad precedent for other people that patronized and played at the store.

 

[Stormonu]

I have strong opinions...

Back in the '90s, I bought some plastic "Star Marines" from the FLGS, at about 30 marines for less than a 10-man GW squad, and made a Land Raider from a pizza box. Had some RB-01 marines and 3E starter marines to boot. However, my local group would not let me play with the "Star Marines" because they weren't "official" GW marines - yet the Pizza box raider was okay because it was a scratchbuild. A couple years ago I discovered paperhammer, and some of the entirely paper models (usually tanks or aircraft) from that blew me away, as I initially thought they were plastic models until I got to pick one up.

Then there was Battlesystem, TSR's mass army system that came with 1" tokens for your forces. Should have seen the faces of the WHFB players when I pulled those out.

And the original battletech boxed set I got came with standees instead of plastic/metal miniatures.

Between paperhammer, standees, chits and minis I could care less what folks are using, as long as I can tell what's its supposed to be. Nobody should be priced out or ashamed of what they use to fill for figures in a game. Sure, I'll always enjoy a well-painted miniature over a scrap of paper with the model name on it, but it wouldn't be a criteria for NOT playing against someone in a game.

For those interested, my Space Marine army - now a few years old
The pizza box RT land raider is near the rear (3rd) on the left - the blue one on the right is an official RT land raider.
The "Star Marines" are in the middle row, with the sergeant's gun pointing left (and still mostly unpainted...)

Spoiler