Number of grapple checks for animal

[youspoonybard]

Sorry. I was doing some reading to make sure, and although I said it in my new edited post, I'll type it out again : P

I'm pretty sure you give up your remaining attacks if you don't take a penalty.

If you take that -20 penalty, you don't give up your attacks, and still have how many bites/claws you have left.

This is done intentionally to keep people from getting a greater number of grapple and normal attacks than their BAB allows a round.

 

[Thanee]

I think the remaining attacks can just be used with a -4 penalty then. Attacks are subsequent and the penalty is not something like Power Attack or Combat Expertise, that you have to choose to apply. It's similar to knocking someone down and then getting an advantage for being prone to subsequent attacks.

The bear could probably also choose to make another grapple attempt at -5 BAB.

Note, that you only have to actually decide upon making a full-attack after the first attack has been done.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Dinkeldog]

I'd recommend having the bear bite first, since he gets to choose his order of attacks. That way, he's not thrown into suckitude by being lucky enough to get into the grapple.

Then again, my interpretation is that animals go with their standard attack routine. Going into a grapple is already such a bad tactical move, it seems wrong to penalize them further.

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

Going into the grapple is only a bad tactical move if the animals are alone or there are very few animals. If the animals outnumber the PCs or if they get the party's rogue and wizard/cleric, grappling is a great tactical move.

I'd recommend having the bear bite first, since he gets to choose his order of attacks. That way, he's not thrown into suckitude by being lucky enough to get into the grapple.

Then again, my interpretation is that animals go with their standard attack routine. Going into a grapple is already such a bad tactical move, it seems wrong to penalize them further.

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

So adding all this up, you maintain that a creature with improved grab and constrict (which includes most constricting creatures) using the damage your opponent manuever would deal damage three times with every successful grapple check:
1. Subdual damage based on size and strength
2. Improved Grab damage based on the weapon used to make the attack
3. Constrict damage as listed.

That seems more than a little excessive to me--especially considering the CR of improved grab/constrict creatures like the otyugh.

WARNING: There is some debate as to what happens in following rounds.

I am of the party that says that when you win an opposed grapple check during your turn, you do whatever you were trying to do with that opposed check (like, pin an opponent, or "damage your opponent") as well as doing Improved Grab damage. If you have constrict, you ALSO do constrict damage.

Note that there is debate over this though.

Hope I'm helping you here!