Odd Subdual Question (my players stay out)

[Drawmack]

.....How about a sap?

The problem with using a sap is that it doesn't solve the problem of weapon switching.

The basis is that the guards start off using their fists. If the PCs attack with weapons then the guards switch to weapons. However, the guards only use weapons to bring the PCs down to their level. So I see the guards standing a possibility of switching between normal weapon damage and subdual damage but I don't want the guards to have to physically change weapons using an MEA. So the guards will have to do subdual with their normal weapons once they've been drawn.

 

[Thanee]

I'd just lower the damage dice by one step, when you use a weapon in a non-standard fashion (i.e. in a way it is not really meant to be used).

2d6 -> 1d10
1d10 -> 1d8
1d8 -> 1d6
1d6 -> 1d4

and so on.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

How about equipping them with quarterstaves that have buttons that when pressed release/retract a spear point? That way they can use it as a half-spear for regular damage, and a quarterstaff for subdual damage...

 

[Rel]

If the guards have shields, you could always have them shield bash (although given the off hand penalties, that would be a very sub-obtimal fighting style for most of them).

I think the best option would be to have them grapple. If there are enough guards, they should grapple and Aid Another to assure that the character stays grappled and gets pummeled with their fists.

Any Arcane spellcasters will be unconscious in seconds if you do this. Once that happens, the guards could threaten to kill them if the other PC's don't surrender (although, this isn't very lawful).

But trust me on one thing: Use overwhelming numbers of guards. You want this encounter to be over as quickly as possible because Hong is right - players do not like being railroaded, especially when it comes to having their characters captured. So do it if you must, but don't drag it out and don't try to make it a balanced encounter.

 

[kreynolds]

How about a maximized empowered empowered subdual substitution delayed blast fireball?

 

[Drawmack]

Oh it's not balanced. I'm using two guards to every character and they are the same level. However, while the players aren't going to like being captured I'm thinking that at least if they get to put up a good fight that'll be something. I think that the players will bitch more if 50 guards overwhelm them with in a single round then if 10 guards take them out in four rounds.

 

[kreynolds]

I think that the players will bitch more if 50 guards overwhelm them with in a single round then if 10 guards take them out in four rounds.

Nah. I can tell you that, as a player, knowing that you (the DM) fear my character so terribly that you would rather not take any risks and just send out 50 guards after me...well...that just makes me all giddy.

 

[Thanee]

But what, if the PCs have a pointy stick, or worse... a banana!

Bye
Thanee

 

[Rel]

Oh it's not balanced. I'm using two guards to every character and they are the same level.

If the party Wizard or Sorcerer has Sleep or Color Spray, and the Fighter has Power Attack/Cleave, 10 guards might be a very doable challenge.

I'm not telling you how to run your game. I'm just telling you that I've been burned on the "Capture The Party" gambit more than once and I've seen it almost wreck a campaign. Since then I've never felt the need to capture a party but if I ever do again, it will be done as a set piece of exposition ("You struggle for a few moments, but it's no use. You wake up in jail.") or use huge odds that the party knows are impossible to overcome.

Also, are you prepared for the consequences of what happens if the party kills one or more of the guards before being captured? And what if they put one guard down and threaten to kill him if the other guards don't back off?

Again, it's your game and you can run it how you want to. I just don't want you to get blindsided by one of these situations and have it ruin your carefully laid plans from the outset.

 

[Archer]

I don't see why the aristocrat can't just hire them like a normal NPC to do the mission without beating them into submission. If the guard carry a note from the aristocrat the PCs will come willingly. Your players will want to kill the aristocrat at the earliest opportunity if brought in by force. Do you want the aristocrat to die? Players like the normal way, your way is like a practical joke, fun for you but not for them.