OGL and copyright

[Psion]

I just saw this post. It was quit helpfull. I think I will see if i can find some of those books on rpgnow.

Here's one on D20 and OGL:
http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=3289&

There's actually a publishing resources category at the left you can browse through.

 

[JVisgaitis]

This gets really deep. Game mecanics aren't copyrightable.

I don't understand patent law, but if that's the case, what's the deal with Wizards holding a patent on tapping cards in Magic?

 

[Delta]

i did find this in my search kindof odd it was on wiki

Other criticism is based around the part of the d20 System Trademark License which defines "Open Game Content" to include game mechanics and purports to license it. It is widely believed that game mechanics are uncopyrightable in the USA...

Friend, I must say I get a sinking feeling in my gut thinking about you starting a publishing endeavor based on this. As someone who follows copyright and gaming issues very closely, this is a highly interesting legal critique.

But the most important thing is that to date, no one has been able to uphold this principle in court against WOTC. Not any writer, not any publisher, not any company. It would be interesting to see a private lawyer or a large competing company contest this issue with WOTC in court. But if you're going to try to depend on this for your business, then you must hire a whole team of lawyers to try and defend it for years in court. No one in the world has dared to try it so far.

Legal issues are inherently not for visual learners.

 

[Delta]

I don't understand patent law, but if that's the case, what's the deal with Wizards holding a patent on tapping cards in Magic?

Patents and copyrights are two completely separate fields of intellectual property law. Item #1 is that lots of people think the patent system is currently broken, there are not enough examiners, and the US patent office basically rubber-stamps everything submitted to it. Item #2 is that the patent may be contestable, but again, no one has had the millions of dollars needed to fund a major legal challenge against WOTC over this issue, either.

 

[Psion]

Missed this...

I read it, but it dosent help me format a book, does it? I can dzn a book just fine, but really i need good examples of the ogl in use, so i can make a book and not have the ogl change my formating and page layout too much. so I was wondering if anyone has good examples. I will check out unearthed arcana. I am a visual learner. I assimilate, its how I learn. so any othe examples?

Yeah, plenty.

Unearthed Arcana may not be the best example, on two counts.

First, wizards formatting and production values may not be within striking distance of a start up publisher.

Second, wizards is primarily writing to an audience that doesn't really know much or care about OGC, so it's not really formatted to be convenient that way.

There's three principal methods I see in outlining OGL and PI.

The first is unobtrusive. Either at the beginning of the book or co-located with the Open Game License (which may be the same thing) is a few paragraphs describing what's open, what's closed, and what's PI. This is the approach that AEG, Malhavoc, and Green Ronin typically use.

Second is to offset all open game content is highlighted boxes or sidebars. Atlas Games' Penumbra line was pretty well known for this, and it's usually indicative of a stance that is more conservative with what is rendered open.

Finally and possibly the least common I see is having a brief OGC statement at the beginning of each chapter. Fantasy Flight Games' hardbounds used this approach.

 

[Psion]

I don't understand patent law, but if that's the case, what's the deal with Wizards holding a patent on tapping cards in Magic?

Patent law is not copyright law. But many find that patent questionable, like many. And patent law is, on a large scale, in need of reform IMO. But that's an opinion I come about by being a software engineer vice having anything to do with gaming...

 

[Moon-Lancer]

ok guys, i got this figured out. *cues curtain*

*edit*

delta, you presume too much, and fear with out reason.

psion thanks for your help. that goes for everyone else that helped me too.

"First, wizards formatting and production values may not be within striking distance of a start up publisher."

perhaps but i feel i can do the art myself. Dzn was burned into you sleepless night after sleepless night at collage. The downside though is it takes forever because its a 1-2 person team. but all great works take a lifetime.

I thank all that have helped me understand the formats used with the ogl *bows*

so yeah, can could a mod please press delete on thier keyboard? thanks.

 

[Delta]

delta, you presume too much, and fear with out reason.

Okay, I was employed at two multi-million dollar computer game companies that are both now out of business. Nobody there took my advice on the big issues either, so this I'm used to.

Best of luck!

 

[Moon-Lancer]

*wipes his cheek*

It felt like you were putting me down, but i if you were honestly giving me advice, then I accept it. I found a friend that knows alot about legal stuff, (business school). and i think i Got a layout that will work

 

[pogre]

Any chance you could partner with a gaming attorney?

Lots of gaming companies have lawyers involved.

I'm not volunteering BTW.

Good luck!