On Marking ("Why you little . . . ")
- Thread starter Simon Atavax
- Start date
RandomCitizenX
First Post
The thing is Hunter's Quarry isn't meant to be a mark. It is the 4e equivalent to the favored enemy of old. The ranger isn't calling the guy out in any way. He is just focusing his attention on him. The only reason an enemy has to attack a ranger who is using the quarry is the bonus damage the ranger is doing. A proper mark imposes a penalty for not attacking the person who marked you, and the only ones that are really effective at range are supernatural in origin (Swordmage and Paladin)
Amphimir Míriel
Explorer
Lets not go overboard. There are only two classes that mark their targets, since the Warlock's Curse and the Ranger's Quarry features do not generate a compulsion on the target to attack the PC.
The Paladin's mark is, for those simulationists out there, a divine spell. Its even there on the power keywords, so I'll leave it there.
Now, the Fighter's mark is purely martial, so this is what makes some people cringe. However, once you see it in play, it is not complicated at all.
Basically, the Fighter's mark is based on his own ability to present himself as the most dangerous threat around. This is activated by an attack, and only lasts a turn.
The Paladin's mark is, for those simulationists out there, a divine spell. Its even there on the power keywords, so I'll leave it there.
Now, the Fighter's mark is purely martial, so this is what makes some people cringe. However, once you see it in play, it is not complicated at all.
Basically, the Fighter's mark is based on his own ability to present himself as the most dangerous threat around. This is activated by an attack, and only lasts a turn.
So a paladin waving a sword at someone from across the room gets to do extra damage? Or is it just that the guy he marks now takes a penalty for not dealing with the the paladin? The first instance makes some sort of sense to me, as long as he's within melee range, but the ranged aspect makes no sense to me. Whatever, if I get more chances to play maybe it'll start to be clearer.
That One Guy
First Post
The Divine Challenge is specifically a divine compulsion (says so in them there rules!). It's sort of like the creature will get negative reinforcement if it chooses not to attack the paladin. Also, to maintain the challenge the paladin must 'engage the target'. This involves attacking the target or physically moving next to it. So the paladin can mark at range, but he has to move adjacent to the enemy, attack it in melee, or throw a javelin at it yelling, "Eat me!" ...or something.
The swordmage is just a jedi.
Bagpuss
Legend
Correct, but if a fighter marks with his bow at range, you can bet it's a distraction (-2 to hit) if you are keeping one eye on him because he's waiting for you to drop you guard so he can hit you with the perfect shot.
In which case you don't have to mark them.
lutecius
Explorer
Exactly
It's not complicated, it just dosen't make sense. The additional attack kind of works but not the penalty.
If it's about the marked ennemy having to defend himself, i see no reason why marks shouldn't stack.
If it's some psychological effect (taunts et al.) I don't see highly trained or high Wis characters being affected without a saving throw.
A penalty to defense against the interrupt would have a similar effect and make a lot more sense. But that clearly was the least of the designers prioritie.
ExploderWizard
Hero
I haven't played 4e yet, but I'm hoping to try it out at some point in the near future (real life keeps interrupting). But a buddy of mine told me something sort of funny but also possibly interesting about his first 4e session.
They were playing a combat when the DM had a goblin (or some other monster, can't remember details) attack my buddy and "mark" him. At first, he was pissed off by the whole concept of "marking" ("Whaddayamean I *have* to attack that monster or take a penalty? What about my freedom as a roleplayer?" etc.). Naturally, a brief debate about the "MMO Mechanics" vs. "True Roleplaying" philosophy ensued.
But something funny happened. My buddy found that once the DM told him the monster had "marked" his character, he became so pissed off at the monster for doing the marking that he found he was actually motivated to *want* to attack that monster first. Instead of the Marked mechanic hindering roleplaying, it actually encouraged/created it. Instead of saying, "I'm marked? So now I have to pretend my character is mad at this monster and has to attack it? What about roleplaying?", he said, "You marked me? YOU marked ME? Why you little (#@$()*@. FEEL THE PAIN!"
I'm excited about trying this game out.
And so your buddy has taken his first step into a larger world. He is now an AI mob that responds to aggro on command. Welcome to the machine.
Amphimir Míriel
Explorer
Thank you for your oh-so-helpful post.
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