On Subraces...

[AngeltheTechrat]

They were in Unapproachable East, that's all I know.

Hmm.. Added to the Realms in 3E? (Gahds.. Didn't the Realms have enough subraces already?)

<looks them up>

Ahh.. Hidden away in a pocket dimention of their own for a long time. I see.. Yup, they definately seem to be on the eledrin side of the elven divide.

 

[Nymrohd]

Their demiplane was dumped in the Feywild on this edition.

 

[The Ghost]

I voted "Other" as it is highly dependent on the type of game being run. If I am running a game in which it is important to understand the differences in the various cultures then I will allow them, but, in a more general campaign, I prefer the players to just stick to the basics.

 

[Barcode]

Choice is good. Subraces are choices, therefore they are good. It is easier to ignore something in a system or setting that you don't like than to try to invent it if they leave it out. For all of the high-fiving that Eberron fans do about the lack of subraces in Eberron, all it boils down to is that the designers decided not to give us DM's something that we may or may not have chosen to use, and then pawned it off as a feature. I personally wish that the Aerenal Elves and the Valenar Elves were mechanically different, since they are different in almost all other ways.

 

[AngeltheTechrat]

Their demiplane was dumped in the Feywild on this edition.

I couldn't find mention of it or them in 4E. The FRPG only addresses Sun and Moon Elves (Eladrin), Wild and Wood Elves (Elves), and Drow. It's a sound theory, though.

Hopefully we'll see more background material in future products or Realms articles in Dragon. Star, Great Sea, Sea of Fallen Stars, and Averiel have yet to be addressed as far as Torilian subraces of Elf.

Shield and Gold Dwarves are also brought up, but no mention of Duergar yet (at least in the Realms). I'm interested in seeing how the Realms handles Duergar being reimagined as red-haired and demonic-blooded now in 4E. (Heehee.. Beard Quills. )

 

[Nymrohd]

The FRCG mentions them (the star elves). And Sildeyuir gets a big mention in the second book of the Last Mythal series (it actually seems to be more beautiful than Evermeet itself). Duergar in FR are in trouble. Laduguer and Deep Duerra are dead. Dunspeirin and their war with the gold dwarves ended abruptly when they rediscovered the roots of the duergar (a clan of shanatar abducted by the illithids of oryndoll) only to have the thrall armies of oryndoll trash both the army of gold and the army of iron. The gold dwarves took the few duergar who survived the attack in and they are now jointly planning a counter while they are getting a defensive position deep in Shanatar (they did not specify where, my guess would be alatorin). I wouldn't find it strange if a lot more duergar worship moradin now.

 

[mhacdebhandia]

Technicaly speaking, Eladrin are High and Grey Elves (and I would say from their origins and visual characteristics, Ghost Elves), while Elves are Sylvan/Wood and Wild Elves, and of course Drow are Drow/Dark Elves.

Well, technically speaking, eladrin are eladrin, elves are elves, and drow are drow.

 

[mhacdebhandia]

but I never read any of the Eberon stuff, so I'm in no way sure what was there.

Eberron generally eschewed subraces entirely. All elves - whether urban-dwelling elves of the Five Nations or the dragonmarked houses, the glory-hungry Tairnadal elves of Valenar, the ancestor-revering Aereni elves of Aerenal, or rural elves living in forests in places like the Eldeen Reaches - were standard, Player's Handbook "high" elves. Eberron preferred to draw distinctions between elven cultures based on culture, not subrace biology. There are at least three published cultures for drow, too, which are explicitly considered a separate race (and have a distinct historical origin - they were created by giants to fight their rebellious kin when the elves were trying to break out of slavery).

That said, there were some different variants of Eberron races that didn't quite rise to the subrace level. Shifters manifested different shifting abilities, like long fangs or sharp claws or tough skin. Warforged were constructed with different kinds of built-in armour (and the non-Eberron Monster Manual III introduced Small-sized warforged scouts and Large-sized quadrupedal warforged chargers, which are more like true subraces).

 

[fanboy2000]

I let players use them when the setting has them. I've never invented new subraces for homebrew settings. I tried to be Sun Elf Wizard in a non-FR campaign once though. I'm a horrible, horrible, person.

 

[mhacdebhandia]

Choice is good. Subraces are choices, therefore they are good. It is easier to ignore something in a system or setting that you don't like than to try to invent it if they leave it out. For all of the high-fiving that Eberron fans do about the lack of subraces in Eberron, all it boils down to is that the designers decided not to give us DM's something that we may or may not have chosen to use, and then pawned it off as a feature.

You're actually quite wrong. It's much, much easier to say to your players "Valenar elves are wood elves in this game" than it is to say "Valenar elves aren't wood elves in this game". It's easier to add something in than to take it out.

(And you don't use an apostrophe to make a plural!)