D&D 4E Paizo and 4e.

[Wulf Ratbane]

I'm sure the guys at WotC love the OGL just as much, if not more so, then us commoners. But their actions don't seem to reflect that. I'm sure they're swamped with work, but they found enough time to close down the listserve.

WOTC had nothing to do with running that listserv. No alarm bells necessary.

 

[kenmarable]

I was under the impression that it was Dancey who was running the listserv, not WotC.

In fact, after checking the last message ...

... I'm pretty certain that it was Dancey running the lists. So it seems to me that Dancey shut down the lists, not WotC.

/M

You are correct (and I say this as someone on the lists since they were created). WotC had nothing to do with the lists, they were Dancey's personal project.

 

[dmccoy1693]

WOTC had nothing to do with running that listserv. No alarm bells necessary.

Alright, my bad.

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

Alright, my bad.

NP-- sorry it ended up looking like piling on.

 

[Hussar]

But a new PH, MM, DMG every year, (and who knows what else), is a whole new level. To me, the 2E crap products felt more like the designer's fault. TSR was paying them, they were just doing a crappy job because they could get away with it. To me, that speaks to the designer's work ethic more than anything. Yeah, TSR should have exercised closer management.

How is this different from a new Complete X book every year? Or rather, several Complete X books every year? Now, they are going to come out with an optional PHB every year. It'll serve the same function as Bo9S or Tome of Magic did for 3e - new classes/races/whatever PHB style mechanics. Same for the DMG (which I suspect will likely look like a new campaign resource book) and Monster Manual - which they actually did produce a new one of every year.

So, other than the name change, how is this different from now? We got a new PHB every year of 3e - it just wasn't called that. Book of Vile Darkness/Exalted Deeds, Tome of Magic, Book of 9 Swords, Unearthed Arcana, Weapons of Legacy, Magic of Incarnum, etc. That's your new PHB every year.

Same old, same old. Just with a new name.

 

[catsclaw227]

How is this different from a new Complete X book every year? Or rather, several Complete X books every year? Now, they are going to come out with an optional PHB every year. It'll serve the same function as Bo9S or Tome of Magic did for 3e - new classes/races/whatever PHB style mechanics. Same for the DMG (which I suspect will likely look like a new campaign resource book) and Monster Manual - which they actually did produce a new one of every year.

Agreed. I hope that they will actually be building the SRD around these additional books though, and the one key difference between the Complete X books and PHB 3 may be that with "core" comes "core SRD" and then the third party companies can use things from them.

I would say that one of the biggest complaints with the OGL/SRD was that the new content that WOTC put out wasn't open.

 

[dmccoy1693]

So, other than the name change, how is this different from now?

Here's how: If I want to play my homebrew campaign setting with the updated rules, I have to not only wait for next year's books to come out (and hope that they will be published there and not year 3 books). Not only that, there will be large sections of the default rules that do not apply to my homebrew. I don't want Thor as a god and tieflings as a major race.

So not only do I have to tell my players, "You can't use these rules. No, I mean it. The answer is still no, Mark. I haven't changed my mind, Mark. I'm still saying no," but I also have to write my own races and classes. If a game requires this much work to make it work, its not worth it.

 

[tenkar]

Here's how: If I want to play my homebrew campaign setting with the updated rules, I have to not only wait for next year's books to come out (and hope that they will be published there and not year 3 books). Not only that, there will be large sections of the default rules that do not apply to my homebrew. I don't want Thor as a god and tieflings as a major race.

So not only do I have to tell my players, "You can't use these rules. No, I mean it. The answer is still no, Mark. I haven't changed my mind, Mark. I'm still saying no," but I also have to write my own races and classes. If a game requires this much work to make it work, its not worth it.

That is an issue with changing from 3.0/3.5 to 4.0... i don't see how that is an issue with a new PH, DMG and MM every year. Do you currently add every new 3.5 MM to your homebrew's mix or do you hand pick what fits (assuming you even buy the MMs beyond the first).

I expect "core" will be next spring's books.

I also expect the "expanded core" will add each years PH, DMG and MM release to the SRD. No one is forcing anybody to use anything beyond the initial releases (except maybe the RPGA Living Campaigns).

Homebrew Campaigns in my experience generally have homebrew rules... the only "core" you need to worry about is the "core" that you plan to use in your campaign.

 

[dmccoy1693]

That is an issue with changing from 3.0/3.5 to 4.0... i don't see how that is an issue with a new PH, DMG and MM every year. Do you currently add every new 3.5 MM to your homebrew's mix or do you hand pick what fits (assuming you even buy the MMs beyond the first).

I expect "core" will be next spring's books.

I also expect the "expanded core" will add each years PH, DMG and MM release to the SRD. No one is forcing anybody to use anything beyond the initial releases (except maybe the RPGA Living Campaigns).

Homebrew Campaigns in my experience generally have homebrew rules... the only "core" you need to worry about is the "core" that you plan to use in your campaign.

So what is the Half Orc Druid suppose to do until the appropriate books come out? How long do I have to wait before the Half Orc Druid gets to play his current character?

 

[DandD]

I thought Half Orcs weren't possible in AD&D 2nd edition Core Rules (my god, what a horrible name).