D&D 4E Paizo and 4e.

[TerraDave]

I'd love to design a 3.75e,

And I would love to see that as well. And I would pay for it.

But I agree with your post, which is why I said what I did.

 

[Charwoman Gene]

HERESY!!! They're only one of the most creative companies

He's not talking about their creativity. He's talking about the 800-lb. gorilla of the brand strength.

 

[Festivus]

HERESY!!! They're only one of the most creative companies in the industry. They absolutely ARE THAT good. True, they are not Wizards, but that's like saying Apples certain aren't Oranges. Well Duh. Paizo puts out some of the best (if not the best) adventures on the market, and until the Expedition series, far better then anything Wizards put out in a while. Now the difference in the gulf has been reduced to Paizo being just "considerably better" then Wizards adventures.

Wizards may come up with the game, but Paizo inspires the imagination. If something happened and WotC went under today, Paizo may not product the next "World's Most Popular RPG" but they will end up being one of the industry's most influencial members.

One could argue that the expedition series has been hit or miss, at least from my vantage point. The only one I liked and bought, Ravenloft. Undermountain, not impressed. Demonweb, not what I was expecting. I haven't seen Greyhawk yet so I can't comment, but that one has a lot of Mona love poured into it.

Pathfinder, Gamemastery? I haven't seen one issue yet that hasn't been superb, and contained something I could use in my own games. If you haven't seen these, take a look. My only hope is that they sway with me... if 4E blows my eyeballs out the back of my head I would fully expect Paizo to follow suit, otherwise I'll just vote with my wallet. If 4E sucks, I hope they continue to publish 3.5 material. Best of both worlds... they provide the other edition statblocks as a download, making the adventures universal.

 

[Frozen DM]

And, by the gods, I hope Paizo (and other companies) don't base their business decisions on the poetic declarations of their messageboard folks. Show me ten posters who claim they will fanatically support a "3.75" edition, and I'll show you one who's maybe telling the truth.

This is my biggest fear. The fact is, message board posters represent only part of a company's audience (and a small one at that). I've noticed many of the most vocal posters on Paizo's boards are strongly anti-4e (because their changing rules, canon, or anything at all). But I am not convinced that the vocal minority would have the buying power alone to support Paizo. I'd be curious to see an analysis between the number of Pathfinder or GameMastery subscribers and the number of vocal anti-4e posters on their message boards. And if Paizo does focus on the desires of this vocal minority, will they be shutting out a larger possible audience down the line that has converted to 4E? Yes, Paizo's hardcore fans will buy whatever they put out (3.5, 3.75, 4E), but the hardcore fans will not be the only thing to determine the success of the company down the line.

I don't think Paizo is intentionally setting itself up to be anti-4E, but based on the atmosphere on their boards, that's the image I get, whether its people complaining about the succubus, or WotC's difficulty in getting the updated SRD out to them in time.

 

[Arashi Ravenblade]

Considering that alot of people are going to switch to 4e, so are alot of other 3rd party companys, it would to me be smart for "Someone" to take over a revision of 3.5 and basically reap all of the profit from the people (as few as they may be) who stuck with 3e.
I personally dont have the money nor resources to do it myself, I would. Heck when 4e was released my first thought was to buy the 4e core books and reverse engineer what was good into 3e so my old books would still be good.

 

[Matthan]

Well, for myself, I want Paizo to go to 4E. I'm excited about 4E, and I'm hopeful that I'll finally be able to get a group together to play again. For the last two+ years, I have heard nothing but great things about Paizo's products (especially their adventure paths) and, to be perfectly honest and selfish about it, I want to run or play in them. I want to pick up Pathfinder when I pick up the new edition and start a game. I've never DMed a campaign before, and I want to give it a try using, what I'm told, is some of the best material on the market. I'm hopeful that I'll get that opportunity. And I think Paizo wants to provide me (and other gamers like me) with that opportunity.

So with nothing but unbridled optimism, Mr. Mona, I look forward to running your material next year.

 

[thundershot]

As much as I love Paizo's products (and NG too), when 4E comes out, that's the game I'm going to play. I'll only buy products that support that. I understand their position (I wish WOTC would kick it into gear), but as a consumer, I'm only going to buy product for "my system". I know this isn't Paizo's fault, but that's just the way it is. I hope everything works out....


Chris

 

[Mercule]

Part of me, a small part, thinks:

It would be cool to see what sort of 3.75 Paizo could come up with.

But I don't necassarilly think that would be good for them.

Oh, I definitely agree. I'd love to see what Paizo and/or Necromancer would come up with. The gaming-related brain trust there is immense. I might even buy the 3.75 PHB based on the authors' names alone.

But, then I'd go right along with 4E. Why? Not necessarily because I'm a sheep. Not even because WotC has a higher production value (I'm a bit uncertain of the "magazine" finish to the hardcovers). Simply because, I'm entertained by bright shinies and 4E will be more of an upgrade to 3.5 than 3.75 would be.

 

[WayneLigon]

It is my impression that Paizo is setting itself up as the anti-4e company, aided by the fans on its forums.

An excellent demonstration as to why all fan response is neither created equal nor should be heeded equally.

 

[SteveC]

This is pretty simple. If Paizo does NOT switch to 4E, Paizo will wither and - likely - die.

Doesn't matter if 4E is superb or stinks. Doesn't matter if the SRD comes out early or late. Nothing matters.

You're kidding yourself, gentle readers, if you think otherwise.

And, by the gods, I hope Paizo (and other companies) don't base their business decisions on the poetic declarations of their messageboard folks. Show me ten posters who claim they will fanatically support a "3.75" edition, and I'll show you one who's maybe telling the truth.

Paizo ain't that Big, and ain't that Good, and it sure as Sunday ain't Wizards of the Coast.

Just the facts, ma'am. Just the facts.

W.P.

Hopefully you have on a flame-proof suit, but I just wanted to say that I agree with you 100%.

Folks, I think some of you are reading too much into WP's statements. He's not bashing Paizo, merely pointing out that once 4E launches, 3X will become an ever-shrinking market. Add to that the fact that no one really knows what a "3.75 edition" would really be, and you end up with taking an increasing share of an ever-decreasing market.

Not good business.

And let's remember: when 4E comes out, it will be new. And shiny. And no one likes new and shiny things more than gamers. 3X will continue to be played, just like all of the earlier editions are, not in a capacity that allows for anything other than a cottage industry to survive based around it.

--Steve