Paladin/monk gestalt?

[Zzyzx]

I read in an earlier thread that the paladin/monk gestalt might be a problem if allowed in a game. I admit that the two classes abilities seem to combine pretty well, but is this combination more powerful than barbarian/cleric, for instance?

Thanks for any advice.

 

[brehobit]

As long as you disallow the Complete Adventure feat that makes multi-class monk/paladins reasonable, I don't think it's broken at all. Serious MAD (all but Int).

And those multi-classing feats should probably be banned in a gestalt game I'd say.

Mark

 

[szilard]

How overpowered the combo is will depend on the ability scores of the PC. In a 28-point buy game, this won't be too bad. In a high point buy game, the massive MAD issues become less problematic.

-Stuart

 

[szilard]

is this combination more powerful than barbarian/cleric, for instance?

Good question.

Defensively,
M/P: amazing saves, tons of immunities, evasion (at high level add damage reduction and spell resistance)
B/C: damage reduction, uncanny dodge, better spellcasting, better hp

Offensively,
M/P: Unarmed Strike, Stunning Fist, Flurry, Smite, Mount
B/C: Rage, better spellcasting

Misc,
M/P: faster, slowfall, weird high-level monk stuff, mount, better skill list, some bonus feats
B/C: trap sense, better spellcasting, better turning

I think it depends on how you want to play. I think the B/C (focus on cleric) could be a terrifying combat caster type, while the M/P (focus on monk) would be a really incredibly fun melee-based character to play.

-S

 

[Ace]

As long as you disallow the Complete Adventure feat that makes multi-class monk/paladins reasonable, I don't think it's broken at all. Serious MAD (all but Int).

And those multi-classing feats should probably be banned in a gestalt game I'd say.

Mark

I agree with the feat ban. Those feats serve similar roles to PRC"s like Mystic Theurge

As far as MAD -- nah

Just take the Serenity feat from Dragon Compendium

This makes WIS your key score for all abilities that normally use CHA.

In a 36 point buy set up (my default for Gestalt) you get

Str 14
Int 12
Wis 16
Dex 16
Con 14
Cha 8

L1 Human
Gestalt
Punk (Paladin/Monk)

Skills 24 (4 monk, 1 human, 1 Int)

feats
H Serenity
L1 Whatever

 

[Zzyzx]

I understand and approve of the limits to feats based on multi-classing. We limit the feats a lot to make things simpler -- and cheaper.

So the ways to limit the "punk" include lower point buy. Hadn't thought through the broad ability score needs for the character. Good to know.


Are there any other combinations that some people might find problematic?

 

[Kafkonia]

I understand and approve of the limits to feats based on multi-classing. We limit the feats a lot to make things simpler -- and cheaper.

So the ways to limit the "punk" include lower point buy. Hadn't thought through the broad ability score needs for the character. Good to know.


Are there any other combinations that some people might find problematic?

Anything with d8 or great HD and cloistered cleric. Especially combat-types. Because everything you give up as a cloistered cleric you get back from your other class, meaning there's no point to taking regular cleric instead.

One you might want to keep an eye on is Rogue (or Monk)/Hexblade. It's not game breaking, but by third level they have Evasion and Mettle (which is the equivalent of Evasion for Will and Fort saves.)

 

[pallandrome]

ACTUALLY, I happen to be playing in a game with a Monk-Pally Gestalt. Stats given are 18, 17, 16, 15, 14, 13, arrange as you please. And yes, while the fella can punch the crap outta pretty much everything, He's no worse (i.e. no better) than the Half-Ogre Sorcerer-Rogue, or the INCREDIBLY effective Ranger-Cleric.

House rules also include getting feats every other level and a free attribute point increase at every level, to offset the low-equipment setting.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

I do not see much in the way of synergy between the Paladin and Monk. Stacked defenses are nice to have, but it does not seem notably powerful.

Why would this combo be a probem?