Paladins and Self Preservation

[Taneel BrightBlade]

Paladins are immune to fear. Yes but that doesn't mean that there idiots, it's so they don't fly when the dragon roars not so they're stuck in battle and unable to do anything but charge, what if the monsters are gonna kill you the destroy the village, couldn't you run and draw them away from the village with your last breath?

 

[kigmatzomat]

Say a paladin is confronted alone by possibly or probably or definitely overwhelming force. What would you say to the paladin fleeing?

"Make sure you outrun them." I mean really, a paladin shouldn't fail at something so basic as running for his life.

I've got a paladin NPC in my game and depending on the circumstances he'd be willing to run like a scared bunny or fight 'til the bitter end. Off on walkabout and find an army of trolls miles from anything? Run like a bunny. Be between the troll army and a city of cute orphans on a 5' wide stone ledge that is the only way into Orphanville? Fight until his limbs get torn from his body.

A hero may take flight when flight is rational. At times fighting to the death is rational in the greater scheme of things. Paladins are heroes because they'll do things that are only rational in the greater scheme of things.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Under most circumstances, fleeing from a superior force is acceptable.

However, it is not acceptable for a paladin to flee a challenge that he's accepted. Nor is it acceptable for him to flee an enemy if doing so would violate his orders, e.g. a paladin with a military unit ordered to fight to the last man to hold a bridge. Nor would it be acceptable for him to flee if doing so would result in the deaths of innocents- sometimes the paladin must sacrifice himself in order to save others.

I would generally agree with this. It reminds me of an old Dragon article on Paladins, entitled "Good Does Not Mean Stupid." I believe it was written by Gary Gygax.

RC

 

[Dirigible]

Asimov's Laws of Paladinics:

I: A Paladin must prevent Evil smiting Good.
II: A Paladin must smite Evil, unless doing so would violate the First Law.
III: A Paladin must preserve its own existance, unless doing so would violate the First or Second Laws.

 

[reapersaurus]

By mentioning "honor", the PHB brings in the Chivalric definition of honor.

This is blatantly wrong, if you are suggesting that this is a core rule, applicable to every D&D campaign.

You can have your own House Rules in your campaign, but in D&D, Paladins do not have a requirement of chivalry, NOR are they knights.

Sorry, it's just not in the rulebook, therefore your interpretations are not supported in 3.5 D&D.

 

[Deadguy]

Paladins are immune to fear. Yes but that doesn't mean that there idiots, it's so they don't fly when the dragon roars not so they're stuck in battle and unable to do anything but charge, what if the monsters are gonna kill you the destroy the village, couldn't you run and draw them away from the village with your last breath?

Quite, Taneel. We are not told exactly why the Paladin has the immunity to fear, but it seems reasonable to posit that it relates to having to fight in a world of supernatural evil, where enemies can freeze the blood by their mere presence (cf. dragons). The Paladin at least is not forced to flee them, but can choose to fight (or not, as this thread dicsusses!)

 

[The_Gneech]

To create another paladin thread. . .

Say a paladin is confronted alone by possibly or probably or definitely overwhelming force. What would you say to the paladin fleeing?

Quasqueton

I'd say he had a brain! However, there still needs to be more context. Is the force slouching towards Hommlet? Then the paladin should race ahead to warn the town. Is the force engaged in seedy-but-not-directly-threatening activity (such as digging up an artifact)? Then the paladin should study them and find out what's going on. Is the force just orcs on a picnic? In that case, the paladin should wish them a nice day.

-The Gneech

 

[Yellow Sign]

I was running a Paladin of Tyr, in City of the Spider Queen. Our cleric just got killed by a big nasty spider and we where close to getting overwelmed and TPK'd. The group started to retreat but our exit required us to climb up a rope to safety. Needless to say we would have been butchered as we tried to escape. So I made a decision to delay the enemy while the rest fled knowing that my paladin would not make it out of there. It was one of the best games I had played in and I did get to kill a few drow before my paladin was killed. The rest of the part escaped with the body of our fallen cleric. Very fun!