Paladins: Why are they balanced?

[shilsen]

Why are paladins 'balanced'? Because D&D is first and foremost a game. This is also the reason black doesn't start down a rook in chess.

That was easy. Next question!

You know, you're beginning to sound a little like Hong nowadays, except that one doesn't feel as much of a desire to whack you with a stick.

Maybe it's just a matter of time.

 

[hamishspence]

Barbarians and Bards: RAW alignment changes

The closest thing I can see is the obesiance points system in FCII (like corruption but for Law instead of Evil)
It says that Evil outweigns Good without atonements. 9 points worth of Evil acts guarantees one's soul is sent to the fiendish planes. (basically, your alignment has changed)

The obesiance system suggests (but doesn't confirm) that 9 points worth of Lawful acts guarantees one's souyl goes to the side of Law. You can atone to fix this. Acts of Law include following the orders of guys you do not respect, carrying out lawful sentences, accepting legal judgements against you.

so, using this system, the DM could show a precedent for making a barbarian/bard shift alignment.

 

[Nightfall]

With Paradigm's new holy warrior/paladins, I'm wondering if people might find them more balanced or not...

 

[Drowbane]

In three short words...

The Paladin is a balanced class. Not shabby, not too powerful, rarely a source of contention from a balance perspective.

Why?

This is a God's chosen agent in the mortal realm. An inspiration to others, a divinely touched beacon of holiness and martial might to bring hope to his allies and terror to his enemies. He wields the blade and holy symbol with equal efficacy. He is accompanied by a celestial companion. He is the only core class capable of losing his class features without a GM screwjob...

Cleric.

Or maybe he's just a slightly tougher ranger with fewer skill points.

If you were a deity empowering your front line in the battle against evil, would you try to keep him from overshadowing Joe Six-pack the fighter?

Cleric.

Shouldn't the Paladin be the most powerful of the core classes rather than merely being that guy who doesn't suck as much as the monk?

Cleric.

 

[Nightfall]

LOL@Drowsbane.

Yeah some how...it all comes back to cleric.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

Shouldn't the Paladin be the most powerful of the core classes rather than merely being that guy who doesn't suck as much as the monk?

Weak core class, frequently crippling code of conduct that controls the group as well, endless arguments.

I hate paladins.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

Hmmn, I think this is a very good question to ask, because the paladin should be mechanically more powerful than other classes. Why is that? Because they are unique in having a mechanical penalty for not being roleplayed properly.

Except the whole group tends to suffer because of the paladin.

 

[Drowbane]

LOL@Drowsbane.

Yeah some how...it all comes back to cleric.

I've considering throwing the BanHammer (tm) at Paladins as a base class and letting Clerics take the UA PrC.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Weak core class, frequently crippling code of conduct that controls the group as well, endless arguments.

I hate paladins.

It all depends on your DM. I've seen paladins like that, sure, but I also saw paladins who were able to hold their own, weren't crippled (but enriched) by their code, and got along rather well with the rest of the group.

Actually, it's often the non-paladins that cause the problems: They see a paladin, think that he's one of those stuck-up, holier-than-thou guys, and starts arguing/verbally attacking him and doing stuff of questionable morals just to spite the paladin.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

It all depends on your DM. I've seen paladins like that, sure, but I also saw paladins who were able to hold their own, weren't crippled (but enriched) by their code, and got along rather well with the rest of the group.

Thats a large part of the problem, given that the vast majority of DM's I've had the misfortune to encounter are complete tools. The paladin code needs to EXPLICITLEY say a few minor things that cant be done, instead of the nebulous mess that exists now, where the average DM will yoink your powers for lying to save an innocent life.

Actually, it's often the non-paladins that cause the problems: They see a paladin, think that he's one of those stuck-up, holier-than-thou guys, and starts arguing/verbally attacking him and doing stuff of questionable morals just to spite the paladin.

Tell that to the DM who wont let you sneak into an evil temple in disguise, use knockout poison on guards, etc. The paladin forces everyone else to play "mother may I" so they dont lose their mediocre powers. Its the class made for attention mongers.