Participation problem

[Crothian]

In my game we have one character that does overshadow the others. She does not hog the limelight, role play more, or out do the others in combat or magic. She out does them in plots and ideas for where the party should go next.

The reason this happens is very simple: she shows more interest in the game then the others. She does know more about the world, she has a stronger background and greater drive for her character. She also will call me throughout the week asking questions on what is going on and what things her character can do. She keeps me up to date with the wants of her character.

Now, I will admit to fault here. My adventures have focused more on her because they take the path of least resistance. She pushes the campaign in a good way, she keeps the plots moving and the adventure flowing. I get feedback from her. I have triued to get the others to participate. Two weeks ago I sent out an e-mail to one of the guys with suggestions for his character as well as asking him for ideas from his character. I never got a reply back from it.

The players I know feel, and rightfully so, that it is her game. She is the lead, but its because she shows more interest and takes the reigns. How can I encourage the others to her level? I don't want to have her reduced to theirs.

 

[Piratecat]

Talk to them, all at once. Tell them what you've told us, and let them know that you'd like to equalize things if they're willing to become more involved.

 

[Teflon Billy]

All of my campaigns follow this model. I have a small cadre of players who are total setting whores. They act in a fashion very similar to your girl.

And I don't see a need to change that frankly.

Some of my players like Tactics more than interacting with the setting. Some show up because my games are popular social events. Not everyone needs to drive the game like your girl.

As long as someone does it, I think that's fine (in my campaign, it's Mike's "Sir Henry Lancaster" who drives the car...the others are, admittedly, passengers)

If your crew is enjoying, I'd say don't "fix" it. A lot of groups seem to work well with a pro-active Leader (1E insisted all parties have this position filled if I recall correctly)

 

[Herpes Cineplex]

I'd say the odds are good that the "less involved" players would, if you asked, point out that they don't have enough free time to spend on keeping you informed about what their characters want, to call you several times during the week to ask questions, and so on. And also pretty good odds that even if they did have ample free time, some of them might not want to spend quite that much effort on it.

It might be a good idea to bring it up with everyone, like Piratecat suggests, but personally, I'd say not to bother yourself about it unless you know that the other players are getting miffed that Miss Superinvolved is getting so much attention. Obviously, she's getting what she wants out of the game; if everyone else is getting what they want out of the game, too, then there's no reason to try to screw up a system that's working for all of you, right?

'Cause honestly, I don't think there's really a good fix for this. You can't force everyone else to spend more time thinking about your game (if they could do it or if they wanted to do it, they'd actually be doing it, right?), and by the same token you can't really ask the player who is gung-ho about the game to back off.

Well, I suppose you could ask her to back off. Or ask her to try to structure her character's goals and plans to include at least one or two other characters, or let her know that you'll only be using one or two ideas at most from all of the ones she's shotgunning you with on a weekly basis, so that the game as a whole is less centered on her PC. If she's a nice, patient, understanding kind of person, she might be okay with trading in a little of her own enjoyment to enhance the game experience for everyone else...but even if she IS that nice, I'd still want to be sure that the status quo is cheesing off the other players before I'd ask her to do something like that.


Or (and this is kind of a weird idea) you could try and take up the "slack" of the other players, if you have a lot of free time. You know, make up some plot hooks and background information and plans FOR them.

For example, a friend of mine was telling me tonight about a clever idea he pinched from rpg.net: the GM puts together a bunch of index cards, each with some piece of semi-generic background information, like "your Uncle George is involved in a criminal organization but has always treated you like his own child," or "you lost something valuable a while back, and have recently learned that it was in fact stolen from you," or whatever. Just a bunch of ideas that are specific to the setting and the game, but not necessarily to any particular character. Then you lay 'em all out face up in front of the players and tell them to pick two to six of the cards, whichever ones they think are interesting.

Then throughout the course of the game, you can hit them with plots that hook into various index cards. The players can bring them up, too, like when they're investigating some kind of shady dealings and whoever grabbed the Uncle George card holds it up at you and says "Yeah, so I figure it's time to visit my uncle to see if he can shed any light on what's going on here." That way, if a player doesn't have the time or the inclination to come up with a detailed character background or lots of goals, they can still have some background details and some goal-oriented plot hooks, and the bonus is that the GM can prepare it all in advance; Uncle George and who stole the valuable object and all that other stuff can all be written up before you even know who's picking what card. You can just plug the appropriate PC in and go.

--
sounds like kind of a fun idea, if you don't mind the prep work

 

[darklight]

Hey HC, thats a wonderful idea, consider it yoinked

Other than that I agree with everything HC said. Unless you are sure the other players have a problem with it, there is no reason to 'fix' it, especially since they might not want it 'fixed'

I have always had a similar problem with the guys I used to play with, except all of them are casual players, who really wont bother with getting to know the setting and spending time on creating cool backgrounds and being proactive in game. At least you have one proactive player

If you are sure it IS a problem, I would talk to all of them to let them come up with the solution. Otherwise they might feel that you tried to straightjacket them into your solution, which wont solve anything.

Good luck!

darklight

 

[Steverooo]

If there is a solution to this problem (and believe me, it is one), then I'd sure like to know what it is... I have been in this same position, and it was no fun.

Seems to me that the "Do-Nots" often get irritated with the "Doers". I'm not really sure why that is. In my case, I was presented with a mystery, with nearly no clues, and immediately started trying to wring them from the stingy Universe. I tried to get the rest of the party involved, and include them in decisions. I asked a lot of questions, and one of them turned up an answer. So off we went to the home of the man with the same questions.

When we got there, I was moving, and wouldn't have a phone for the next month or so, so I had my character wait outside the city. This prompted a PC (who was being played as an... donkey, so we'll call his PC "JA") to ride after mine, making a mock attack with a sling, yelling "Have you forgotten why we came here?"

I hadn't, my PC (we'll call him E) had found the clue that led us here... Rather than attack, I had Emake an impossible Hide roll, and disappear into a gully, and I sat out the next month of play. One of the other players (who would later become a problem, we'll call him G) started making disparaging remarks about my PC. During that time, the PCs questioned the NPC (B), and started off to find another (M). That's when I (and E, my PC) rejoined them.

The second NPC (M) was a fount of knowledge, so I asked him a lot of questions. Then the disparaging player (G) says we're wasting time doing this, so I/E say(s) "Okay, I'm going to the store". As soon as he thinks I can't hear him, he starts with the back-biting, again. Now he (G) says E is running off when the rest aren't ready to leave! (Make up your mind, willya?)

So now everyone else is staying to talk to the NPC, I go off to search the town, talk to a third NPC and gain some more information (which never got shared with the group), meet up with another PC (A) rejoining the group, go to meet a fourth NPC (W, who I offend and get no information from), and meet up with the group finally coming from the second NPC's (M's) going to see the fourth (W), so I pass, and go to a fifth place. When we're ready to leave, along comes the rest of the party. We wait, they mostly ignore us.

Later, we go to yet another place, and they go back to where they left the... donkey PC (JA) who attacked mine. He has been carted off to jail (my PC saw it). When they return, E/I tell them about it, but he can't be gotten out, for a while...

Anyway, we all get together for that night, and the GM has an NPC who accompanies the party (D) wake mine (E) for a big meeting. During this, the disparaging PC (G) uses every opportunity to cause trouble for mine. I stand up for him, but let it go. At the end of the meeting, my PC says something like "You spellcasters might want to get together and coordinate spells for the morning... but then again, teamwork isn't the rule here, is it?"

And the fight was on! One of the other PCs (Dog) invites my character to leave. Another one (H) says "That's a good idea; here's my list of spells and why I'm taking them". Another one (T) threatens to memorize Magic Missiles just for me! The GM quickly moves us a day or two along, to get past the fight, and we arrive at our objective. My PC (who has been staying silent since the fight) suggests that we might want to go ask some locals about the spooky ruins, before we head in... The group actually takes the suggestion, we do, then go explore.

We get there, and have a fight. As soon as the fight is over and my PC says something, my friend in the party (A) says "You may have a sharp tongue, my friend, but also a sharp eye and sharp mind!" Which sets off the disparaging character (G), again. Which causes the one new PC in the party (P) to also jump in on my character, making E the party's verbal "Whipping Boy"...

Now at this point, I wondered to myself, "Now WHY am I getting ready to go down into a dungeon, and risk life and limb with these people?" I think about that... I think about "When did this game stop being fun?" I realize that it never was, but that I was just doing my best to make it fun...

So I say "Here, (D, the NPC who was fireballed and lost all her stuff), I don't seem to be able to do much with these. See if you can do better." I hand her my party magic items, say "I'm going to go check on the horses" (prompting some more disparaging remarks), and quit the game.

The funniest part is, the PCs finish this first part of their seven-part quest, get no treasure, head back to town, and then go "It's been so long, I forgot... Where do we head next?" (No one but "the pesky Elf" took notes, apparently).

By the time the first fight was over, 2 PCs had dropped (including T, the one who was going to Magic Missile me, who was replaced by another player who admitted that he really wasn't a Mage, but a spy). After I dropped, the party recovered one more piece before nearly all the players had dropped. The campaign ground to a halt, and died.

Doers... Your PCs can't live with'em, and your Campaign can't live without'em.

 

[DragonLancer]

Crothian, I wish I had someone like that in my game. My players are more like the rest of your group.

 

[diaglo]

Hiya,

read the story hour in my sig.

it is my character's journal. i like writing it. it helps me remember what is what.

i try and encourage the others to add or write their own... but maybe cuz i have more time to spend on the game than they do...

well you get the picture. my character doesn't drive the game. but... during the sessions the other players expect me to remind them.. names (NPCs, items, and places) and time lines and who's carrying what and ...

each player has a role as well as each character.

i'd like the role of tactician for the group... but since many of the other players would object to me telling them where to stand and what to use... i've fallen into the role of storyteller.


since our games are few and far between now.. my role has become even more important to me. it is the only way i can remember what happened last session. i hope it helps the rest of the players too. but some times during sessions i'm not so sure.

 

[Henry]

Steveroo, I'm afraid your recounting left me lost and a little more than confused. I'm unclear where you are talking about yourself and where you are talking about your character, and also who is who. Some character names and some player names (faked to protect the innocent) might help the confusion a bit. Just a suggestion.

-------------------------------

We (like most groups) have a similar problem. Our group's other DM (goes on these forums by Torm) takes a more active role in-game, and most of the others tend to follow based on his inclinations, and they really don't seem to mind. One other player in the group is a "middle-doer", and when Torm doesn't have a general direction in mind, he kicks in with his own ideas, but is generally satisfied with the direction Torm goes.

A third player we have, is sort of shy in-game, but if you draw him out through a bit of role-play, can and will take a dominant lead. Thing is, this third player is probably the most proactive player outside of game we have - e-mailing for questions, making character plans out-of-game, etc. but he's more interested in the character's progress (both stat-wise and socially) than he is in storytelling. He'd be an excellent player, if he could just forget about that fourth wall a bit more often. The others in the group contribute, and have fun, but generally are content to enjoy combat when it's called for, progress their characters, and have fun. (One's a bit younger and still getting his role-playing ropes, and the other is a more casual player, but definitely knows his rules). In all, it's never hurt us in the past, and I don't see the distribution of leadership changing much.

 

[Belen]

Do you have a mail list for the group?

I would recommend creating a yahoo group for your DnD group. Then, she can participate online with her ideas and everyone else in the good can be a part of it. I think it is always a good idea to include everyone in the process and her phone calls are exclusive to you, the GM.

I started using a yahoo group as a mail list and a files repository about 4 years ago. It has been the best possible decision. The entire group can just hang out and e-mail each other, post files, talk about the game etc.

It could go a long way to getting more people to participate.

Otherwise, I think it is great that you have someone in your group that dedicated. Most of my players are weekend warrior types, except one person who really only has that type of enthusiasm for LG.