PC-Ally minions - how should you treat them?

[Danceofmasks]

4e is by definition metagamey.
If you can tell which monsters are minions, you can tell which allies are minions, too.

 

[LostSoul]

Any general suggestion as to how I should do this?

For instance:

How many, at what level (relative to the party)?
How much XP should the minions get (after all, they are making the encounter easier, so I should factor that into the XP budget)?
Who gets to control the minions (I certainly don't want to), and what initiative should they go on?
Should they get morale rolls (otherwise, PCs treat them as cannon fodder).

Treat them like magic items.

They should be high enough level so that they can hit things.
They shouldn't get any XP at all. Don't worry about the XP budget.
Allow any PC to control one with a Minor action as they shout orders. (The minions don't do anything on their own except avoid danger.) Each minion can only act once per round. (They can't act again until the start of the PC's next turn.)

Doing it that way makes a minion like a squishy, movable magic item that allows the user to make an attack that deals some damage with a Minor action. I think that a level 1 minion might be worth a level 1 magic item, level 2 for level 2, etc. This also gives you a GP value for hirelings - the GP value for a contract with a certain guy.

Let the PCs heal them back up after the combat if they "die". Make it a Hard check and the DC level equal to the level of the encounter (or the monster that killed them, but that's probably not worth it).

That's how I was running it, and everything seemed to work well. The players got bored of their minion servants and left them behind after a while, though.

 

[nittanytbone]

He's not as involved as that.

He's just "Well, we're going to go storm X encampment. It'd be dumb to do that with just the five of us! We need some dudes." Just the idea of their presence is enough to suit.

He's an ol' 2e vet where followers just popped up and followed you around, and you got your own keep at level 9, etc.

In that case, it sounds like you should go with a cinematic "one-shot" option.

(A) OPTION 1: INCLUDE THE NPCs IN THE ENCOUNTER
- If this is the case, subtract XP equal to the XP value of the NPCs from the encounter. This effectively lets you add additional monsters to each encounter.
- They get their own set of actions.
- I would advise including at least one "named" NPC built using the DMG rules. This allows you to have a more durable individual with a name who the PCs may actually build rapport with. Perhaps he is a grizzled veteran, a militia sergeant, or just touched by destiny.
- I think 4 x Minions + 1 x named NPC would be the max I'd want to include. You could even do 2 or 3 minions, or just the named NPC.

(B) OPTION 2: KEEP THE NPCS OFF STAGE
- Include the NPCs in a largely narrated, off screen encounter. "You heroes sneak into the gatehouse and let down the drawbridge. Then we'll storm the bailey!" The PCs are included in the pivotal action and the NPC activity will be largely off-screen.
- You could include some NPCs in an encounter with the PCs, making this a hybrid with OPTION 1. Perhaps a squad of militia get in over their heads and need help. Or, contarily, perhaps the PCs need help because an encounter was too tough -- throw in 4 x Militia Minions and subtract one monster's worth of XP.

 

[LightPhoenix]

(B) OPTION 2: KEEP THE NPCS OFF STAGE
- Include the NPCs in a largely narrated, off screen encounter. "You heroes sneak into the gatehouse and let down the drawbridge. Then we'll storm the bailey!" The PCs are included in the pivotal action and the NPC activity will be largely off-screen.
- You could include some NPCs in an encounter with the PCs, making this a hybrid with OPTION 1. Perhaps a squad of militia get in over their heads and need help. Or, contarily, perhaps the PCs need help because an encounter was too tough -- throw in 4 x Militia Minions and subtract one monster's worth of XP.

Does it count as being ninja'ed if the post was already made before you chose to reply?

This is how I would do it as well, if you don't want the hassle of controlling them. You can give the players a benefit by taking some of the minions out of the battle so they can focus their efforts on the real threat. Simply describe the minions and followers as duking it out over to the side. Maybe pick an initiative count to describe what's going on offstage, so it still feels like part of the fight.

 

[ForbidenMaster]

Why not treat them like a mount?

You can allow the PCs and the creatures they ride to get their own sets of actions, especially if a character rides a powerful, intelligent monster such as a dragon. However, at that point you have effectively added an additional member to the party. If you do this, add an additional XP value of monsters to the encounter equal to the mounts’ XP value. When granting the PCs experience, subtract these “bonus” monsters from the XP total.
You should use this rule if the mount’s level i at the party’s level or higher, or if its level is no more than two below the characters’ level. Lower-level mounts are too weak to have a big effect on the encounter. As usual, use your common sense. If a lower-level mount manages to prove a big help to the party, add extra creatures and hold back XP as above.

DMG page 46

 

[Rechan]

Because that would only grant control of 1.

And it would result in the inevitable "Wait, these are individuals, and they're soldiers. WHy do they need my action to act?[/i]" that results in the feeling of arbitrary gamist rule.

(Note: Not that I mind the arbitrary gamist rule, but it seems to rub my players the wrong way.)

 

[ForbidenMaster]

Because that would only grant control of 1.

And it would result in the inevitable "Wait, these are individuals, and they're soldiers. WHy do they need my action to act?[/i]" that results in the feeling of arbitrary gamist rule.

(Note: Not that I mind the arbitrary gamist rule, but it seems to rub my players the wrong way.)

I meant more along the lines of how it effects the combat, ie making it more or less difficult and how to handle XP. I forgot about the shared actions.

EDIT: As per my previous post:

You can allow the PCs and the creatures they ride to get their own sets of actions[....]

What it essentially comes down to is if the minions make a difference, up the encounter XP. If they dont, then dont worry about it.

 

[Rechan]

I meant more along the lines of how it effects the combat, ie making it more or less difficult and how to handle XP. I forgot about the shared actions.

Ah, good point.

 

[DEFCON 1]

I'm gonna concur with the others about keeping the ally minions off-stage, fighting off-stage enemy minions, and just describing what is going on with them at the end of each round. Don't bother with attack rolls or damage, and at the end depending how long it took the PCs to finish off their opponents, you can narrate how many allies/enemies were injured and killed in the battle. If all the warlord wants is a fight to "make sense" by going in with a squad or platoon, then there's no reason to get all that caught up in the individual actions of those NPCs.