D&D (2024) Pets: Find Familiar and Find Steed.

[MarkB]

True the rogue package said once on each of "your turns". I gave feedback on that which was negative and I know others did as well. I hope that gets changed in the next rogue package.

Given that the Paladin's smite was only nerfed down to once per turn rather than once on your turn, there may be hope for that.

 

[Deset Gled]

The more I think about it, the more I like the general idea of a templated familiar. I just backed Tome of Magic 2 and one of the many features in it (it's going to be a stuffed book) is a list of more familiars. The Complete Wizard's Handbook back in 2E, as I recall, also featured something similar.

But players shouldn't be scouring books, just like druids used to, trying to find good familiars.

I see the benefits of the templated familiar, but I'm still not a big fan. Different animals used to have a unique quality to them. The template technique feels very "samey" to me. IMNSHO, there should be more mechanical differences between a hedgehog and a corgi familiar. YMMV.

Also, scouring through source books for things like unique familiars (or creatures, or spells, etc) has traditionally been something I enjoyed about character creation. Reading through a book with eyes searching for a specific build is both fun, and a good way to explore the material deeper. Admittedly, these days I'm more likely to Google first and scour later (and less). Maybe that's part of the reason for the change.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I see the benefits of the templated familiar, but I'm still not a big fan. Different animals used to have a unique quality to them. The template technique feels very "samey" to me. IMNSHO, there should be more mechanical differences between a hedgehog and a corgi familiar. YMMV.

Also, scouring through source books for things like unique familiars (or creatures, or spells, etc) has traditionally been something I enjoyed about character creation. Reading through a book with eyes searching for a specific build is both fun, and a good way to explore the material deeper. Admittedly, these days I'm more likely to Google first and scour later (and less). Maybe that's part of the reason for the change.

Oh, for beneficiaries of the current system, it's a nerf. On the other side of the screen, the old system was a problem.

And, frankly, I'm not sure how "samey" the new summoning and shapeshifting system is if all of the internet is telling druids the correct answer for every situation is velociraptor.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

Oh, for beneficiaries of the current system, it's a nerf. On the other side of the screen, the old system was a problem.

And, frankly, I'm not sure how "samey" the new summoning and shapeshifting system is if all of the internet is telling druids the correct answer for every situation is velociraptor.

Excellent point, a lot of stat blocks even got used because a subset was always more powerful. This version also encourages rp creativity. Want to turn into an Owlbear, you can be a Dire Squirral, A flying Dinosaur, a Tressysm, a Griffin, Giant Bug, or Cringer from He-Man.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

At UC Santa Cruz, the druids can all turn into Dire Banana Slugs.

 

[Deset Gled]

Oh, for beneficiaries of the current system, it's a nerf. On the other side of the screen, the old system was a problem.

And, frankly, I'm not sure how "samey" the new summoning and shapeshifting system is if all of the internet is telling druids the correct answer for every situation is velociraptor.

Was it really a problem for familiars? I wasn't aware of any notable issues there.

I would posit that the discussion of shape shifting is a very different topic, that goes of in a number of directions unrelated to familiars. I can't really see a justification why the many issues with that system should affect the rules for familiars (or steeds). Very different mechanics.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Was it really a problem for familiars? I wasn't aware of any notable issues there.

Everyone feeling pressured to have an owl because of flyby attack is an issue, IMO.

I would posit that the discussion of shape shifting is a very different topic, that goes of in a number of directions unrelated to familiars. I can't really see a justification why the many issues with that system should affect the rules for familiars (or steeds). Very different mechanics.

They're using the same system throughout -- on summons, familiars, steeds and shapechanges -- because they don't want to have to limit what they can include monster books because they'll end up being unintended power boosts to summons, familiars, steeds and shapechanges.

It becomes yet another balancing hassle, one that they will inevitably fail on, because they only have to put a tressym or owl or brown bear or a velociraptor into a book once for everyone to seize on using a very small list of critters to power up spells and abilities that were intended to be weaker.

Without having to worry about this, designers are free to get more wacky with low level beasts and such, since the problems they can cause are limited to encounters where the DM deploys them, not every time the sorcerer or druid player hits Google.

 

[MGibster]

Disappearance of the Familiar. No more picket dimension for safe keeping. If you dismiss your familiar, it leaves all its stuff (so no hiding-rings tricks, etc.) and you don't get it back without recasting. This is another big change for how familiars will play, and it is only partially mitigated by...

I honestly don't think anyone in my games ever dismissed a familiar, they just "disappeared" because nobody really felt like keeping track of them until there was a reason to do so. Looking at these rules, I'm not sure that will change.

 

[MGibster]

Everyone feeling pressured to have an owl because of flyby attack is an issue, IMO.

It's a fairly common problem in games where you get a myraid of choices. What happens so very often is there are a handful of obviously superior choices that get used frequently while others just languish unused and unloved. We might be talking spells, weapons, or Feats, but there's almost always some that are subpar.

 

[mellored]

Was it really a problem for familiars? I wasn't aware of any notable issues there.

Everyone used an owl familiar, because it had fly by attack.
Which made it the only on that could be used in combat. Also darkvision and flying are just great for scouting.

Anyways. You can have a template + unique features. Here's a list from pf2 for instance.

Familiars - Classes - Archives of Nethys: Pathfinder 2nd Edition Database

Find steed does get a custom bonus action. But that too can be expanded.