Pirating RPGs. (And were not talking "arggg" pirate stuff here.)

[Shining Dragon]

Copyright infringment is as wrong as theft, but they are not the same thing. Thanks.

And arguing about the "incorrect" usage of theft when describing copyright infringement is a common tactic used by people who don't like being called thieves.

Their infringement of copyright takes money from the pockets of the copyright holders, which is almost tantamount to theft. But arguing semantics is a good way to make themselves feel better and avoid the issue at hand. Maybe its because copyright infringement isn't among the 10 Commandments and so isn't technically a sin?

I wonder if we'll see the other common justification of "I wasn't going to buy it anyway".

Edit: Not that I'm accusing you specifically of anything, Psionicist. I just thought that your post made a good jumping point for my own.

 

[Rodrigo Istalindir]

Interesting short thread from DTRPG's board. They don't want to go back to DRM either.

(I also sent them a message while I was there about their cert.)

 

[Ace]

Yep. A free PDF I put up about a week ago has had about 150 downloads. A for sale PDF put up around the same time has sold 10 copies.

I really think a lot of the people downloading the free stuff don't even read it -- they collect PDFs.

Kinda guilty here with LEGAL pdf's only.

I will download almost anything OGL that is free and legal. PDF's take up essentially no space.

I do have an excuse though -- I write a little and playtest a lot of D20 stuff and it helps to keep up

 

[dagger]

Education is the thing that change this.

Of course, that would also change the government, industry, etc. as well

Most of these groups start in institutions of higher learning.

 

[Turjan]

Their infringement of copyright takes money from the pockets of the copyright holders, which is almost tantamount to theft. But arguing semantics is a good way to make themselves feel better and avoid the issue at hand. Maybe its because copyright infringement isn't among the 10 Commandments and so isn't technically a sin?

I wonder if we'll see the other common justification of "I wasn't going to buy it anyway".

No, because it's not a "justification". It's just a correction . The infringement of copyright potentially prevents money from getting into the pockets of the copyright holders. The way you formulated the sentence it is objectively false.

Edit: Just to make it clear: I don't download copyrighted stuff from p2p networks.

 

[Nifft]

Meh.

I've bought lots of stuff that I never used after buying (book and PDF, both). Are the publishers "thieves" who "stole" my money by advertising dirty, rotten lies? Will they return the bucks I've spent if I return their PDFs?

They are compensated for "pirates" who "steal" their property by fools like me, who buy stuff & then never use it. I hope someone out there is getting good use out of a PDF they've "pirated", and that some publishers are enjoying the jingle of my ill-earned cash in their pockets.

I think there's a lot of whining going on, and it's really kinda annoying. People will always buy stuff, people will always "steal" stuff. If more people are stealing your stuff than you'd like, you need to lower the price, or add more value via services (like updates).

-- N

 

[Ace]

Yep. A free PDF I put up about a week ago has had about 150 downloads. A for sale PDF put up around the same time has sold 10 copies.

SNIP

part of this is the nature of the web though. Thanks to the OGL there is a vast amount of free legal D20 stuff out there for the taking, more than anyone can use in fact. It can make it really hard to sell a low percieved value item like a pdf -- even at a buck or two.

Its hard to compete with free

The real problem is when the line between -- here are my houserules 'n cool vanity stuff for you -- free and legal and 'kewl a PDF of the monster guide -- might as well grab it get blurred.

 

[Gilwen]

Cost of doing business. That what this is....no matter what you do your stuff is going to get stolen...period. You have a business decision to make not an emotional one. You determine your risk of being in the PDF market and decide what you can stand to lose if you determine it be too high of a risk stay out of that market until you can find a way to lower the risk.

What is going on is illegal and wrong but it will always be a barrier to entry for some. And absolutely don't fall into the trap that the Records and Movie ppl (who i feel have made their problem worse) have in thinking that every single person who downloaded the stuff would have been a sale, that is akin (IMO) to crying about ppl who browse in a store and leave with out buying.

Gil

 

[Ace]

THat's not what's wrong with this. DRM would not have stopped this as he seems to thing or idcate. And why these might not be lost sales, it is a bunch of people who have the product and did not pay for it. It doesn't matter if they would have bought it or not, all that matters is they stole it here.

Short of banning peer to peer software, broadband and scanners there is no way to stop the unlawful distribution of PDF's -- None at all

Even if every non PDF game company went strictly to paper only it wouldn't matter -- these guys get a kick out of what they are doing and wouldn't hesistate to simply scan the whole book --

It sucks but there is nothing that can be done

 

[Turjan]

Well, just to consider the original post. If only 34 people actually bought the pdf, it shouldn't be impossible to locate the one who distributed the copy. Just a thought .