JiffyPopTart
Bree-Yark
3e half-orc cleric with Strength and Destruction domains. Maxed out STR.
Chef's Kiss
Chef's Kiss
D&D 5E Playing non-healer clerics
...Pholtus take the wheel.
It's a metaphor, folks. It's your prerogative to play a non-combatant utility wizard just like it is your prerogative to play a non-healer battle cleric. But leaving a chunk of your toolbox at home because "it's not what you do" smacks of the same sort of player entitlement as the "but it's what my character would do" phenomenon.
No, no one else at the table should define your role for you. You should define your own role so that it benefits the party, and doesn't arbitrarily rob them of their access to part of the ruleset.
By all means, play the character you want to play, but play the character. The game has a class that heals, and you picked it. Don't want to be expected to heal when it's needed? Reskin a different class as a priest. Really married to the idea of playing a cleric? Find a different game, where clerics don't get healing powers.
I am married to the idea of a cleric that does not often heal. Clerics in 5E do a lot more than heal. They can do a lot more than heal. To use your own analogy against you - Wizards get a TON of utility spells and they are limited to only 4+2 spells in their book per level as part of their class. Since your Wizard can get a ton of utility spells maybe I should just expect or demand that your Wizard take utility spells instead of combat spells. If you don't like that maybe you should reskin a different class as magic-user that does not get utility or play a different game where Wizards don't get utility spells!
To go further down this thread I will point out that ANY class can get cure wounds through a feat and Wizards get more slots per day than clerics. If you expect my cleric to heal, why shouldn't I expect your Wizard to heal, when after level 4 you can actually get MORE daily slots to spend on Cure Wounds as a Wizard then I can as a Cleric?
I mean seriously what is the difference?
MichaelSomething
Legend
Thanks Gygax for 4th Edition! It laid the foundation for many elements in 5E that liberated the Cleric from the healbot role.
Akso, the wand of cute light wounds also dserves a shout out.
Akso, the wand of cute light wounds also dserves a shout out.
Clint_L
Hero
Dude, all I stated was that your analogy is flawed. Fireball is a demonstrably good spell, so much so that there is a long thread on these forums about how hard it should be nerfed. Cure wounds is a demonstrably meh spell that is far inferior to healing word....Pholtus take the wheel.
It's a metaphor, folks. It's your prerogative to play a non-combatant utility wizard just like it is your prerogative to play a non-healer battle cleric. But leaving a chunk of your toolbox at home because "it's not what you do" smacks of the same sort of player entitlement as the "but it's what my character would do" phenomenon.
No, no one else at the table should define your role for you. You should define your own role so that it benefits the party, and doesn't arbitrarily rob them of their access to part of the ruleset.
By all means, play the character you want to play, but play the character. The game has a class that heals, and you picked it. Don't want to be expected to heal when it's needed? Reskin a different class as a priest. Really married to the idea of playing a cleric? Find a different game, where clerics don't get healing powers.
But now you raise the argument that healing is the essential part of being a cleric and folks who don't go that route are playing the class wrong. I totally reject that premise, because 5e clearly rejects it as well. Maybe someone has the character fantasy of playing a war cleric who could give a crap about healing. Who are you to say that folks should play a different game if they don't want to play D&D the way you like it played?
kigmatzomat
Hero
We have a cleric who took the life domain & healer feat and the net result is he uses fewer spell slots on healing and more on being his god's expression of righteous retribution.
During combat he uses his Channel Divinity(preserve life) to keep people on their feet. Out of combat the healer kit is worth a mass cure or several cure spells for essentially free.
For our 12th level party, his two Channel Divinities are worth a total of 120hp, which he can do while also maintaining a spell & using spiritual weapon. When combat ends he can heal 12+4+d6 hp per person taking 1 round & 0.5gp of materials. If all six of us are hurt, it takes 3gp and less than a minute for him to dish out ~117hp in healing with zero spell slots.
And aside from the fighter, the rest of us also have some kind of healing/don't-die abilities.
The paladin has 60hp of Lay on Hands healing/disease/poison curing and has Inspiring Leader, worth 17hp/person/short rest. The warlock has Remove Curse & Spare the Dying. The monk got proficient with a herbalism kit to make healing potions so we all have a couple. Lastly, my bard has Healing Word and I can attune the party's Staff of Healing if the cleric is downed.
So all said and done, each person can get at least 40hp of healing/temp hp from feats, there is 180hp of CD/LoH, a couple of us have don't die/stand up spells, and all of us have plenty of potions.
Which means the cleric can choose violence.
During combat he uses his Channel Divinity(preserve life) to keep people on their feet. Out of combat the healer kit is worth a mass cure or several cure spells for essentially free.
For our 12th level party, his two Channel Divinities are worth a total of 120hp, which he can do while also maintaining a spell & using spiritual weapon. When combat ends he can heal 12+4+d6 hp per person taking 1 round & 0.5gp of materials. If all six of us are hurt, it takes 3gp and less than a minute for him to dish out ~117hp in healing with zero spell slots.
And aside from the fighter, the rest of us also have some kind of healing/don't-die abilities.
The paladin has 60hp of Lay on Hands healing/disease/poison curing and has Inspiring Leader, worth 17hp/person/short rest. The warlock has Remove Curse & Spare the Dying. The monk got proficient with a herbalism kit to make healing potions so we all have a couple. Lastly, my bard has Healing Word and I can attune the party's Staff of Healing if the cleric is downed.
So all said and done, each person can get at least 40hp of healing/temp hp from feats, there is 180hp of CD/LoH, a couple of us have don't die/stand up spells, and all of us have plenty of potions.
Which means the cleric can choose violence.
aco175
Legend
And your fighter at least has 2nd wind which is like a cure. With the rest of the party having some healing stuff, I can see where the cleric can take it easy on the healing. Some parties are not that lucky.
DMZ2112
Chaotic Looseleaf
I absolutely should. If you're in a D&D party with a wizard who refuses to use utility spells because they take up slots they could be using for direct damage, yes, you have every right to be annoyed. All players should strive to be as useful to the party as they can be. That is a reasonable expectation.
Nobody has made any demands or said anything about making demands.
Clerics have access to healing magic for free. Engaging this class feature costs you literally nothing. How is that the same as requiring a PC of a different class to take a feat to get the same utility?
I never wasn't raising that argument.
Sure, as evidenced by some of the more martially focused cleric subclasses losing access to healing spells, oh no wait.
Someone who doesn't tolerate selfish behavior at my table, mostly.
JiffyPopTart
Bree-Yark
Why do you view it as selfish to be a cleric who doesn't focus on healing? If I want to play a character who bashes skulls why is it selfish to build that character with a cleric chassis instead of a barbarian?
Either some other player can play a healing character or nobody can play one and the party will just have to be more careful or rest more often.
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