Gate Pass Gazette Playtest the ARTIFICER (Kickstarter backers only)

[Stalker0]

UPDATE: I updated my table above, which now includes average spell slots. Further, I have withdrawn my initial analysis, as there was a major mistake in my understanding of the class that lead to an erroneous review.

 

[niklinna]

UPDATE: I updated my table above, which now includes average spell slots. Further, I have withdrawn my initial analysis, as there was a major mistake in my understanding of the class that lead to an erroneous review.

Looking at your table, it's clear that an artificer can potentially get a lot of casts of low-level spells. It makes this aspect of the class much more like a sorcerer than a wizard...which doesn't feel quite right. And yet I like the basic idea of devices that can fizzle.

Going back to the limited number of spells prepared, what if an artificer could prepare multi-spell inventions that can cast 1 or 2 spells, but if the invention fizzles, all of the spells it can do are unavailable? (Possibly available in a different invention, if we have redudant prepared spells.) So, say we change "Spels Prepared" to "Number of Spell Inventions", and at some particular levels, each invention can include an additional spell?

Then you have a little puzzle each day of which combinations of spells to put in which inventions, too. Do I pair low-level spells with high-level, for good utility with the occasional nova? Do I pair low-level with low-level for maximal utility through the day, and high-level for high-level for that one-shot that might need to be one thing or the other?

 

[xiphumor]

As much fun as the fizzle mechanic is, it means that the Artificer sacrifices flexibility for more spell slots, which I think goes somewhat against the goal of the class. The Artificer, to me, is a maverick who is somewhat ready for any situation. Keeping them as a prepared spellcaster helps with this, but the fact that they only get to prepare a very small number of spells every day makes them somewhat limited in terms of utility. In short, I want an Artificer who feels more like a Rogue and less like a Sorcerer.

Now, they might compensate for this with magic items, but I think there needs to be a lot more guidance and assurance that they can construct certain magic items when they level up than is currently given. Unlike wizards, who know they'll learn new spells as they gain levels, the magic items Artificers have available to them seems somewhat up to DM fiat. I think promising that Artificers will be able to create certain magic items at certain levels (as with the Replicate Magic Items Infusion) would help make the class more reliable and help reduce the mental load on DMs.

 

[WanderingMystic]

As much fun as the fizzle mechanic is, it means that the Artificer sacrifices flexibility for more spell slots, which I think goes somewhat against the goal of the class. The Artificer, to me, is a maverick who is somewhat ready for any situation.

I don't think going back to the o5e spell casting way is a good idea. If you think the class is too limmited with their selection of spells then an ability that allows them to reconfigure a device on a short rest, or the ability to destroy one of their devices to reproduce any of the artificer spells they are capable of casting.

See I see an artificer as someone with a small number of devices (spells) who can use them more frequently than an normal spell caster but who can jurry rig a device at a cost if they need to.

As far as magical item creation I think that the artificer should be able to create their own blueprints by trial and error so they don't need to examine an existing magical item to try to reproduce it.

 

[WanderingMystic]

For ease

Wow I had started doing the math but looking at those number, they don't need to reroll 1s, and I don't even know if they need the die type to increase.

 

[Faolyn]

As much fun as the fizzle mechanic is, it means that the Artificer sacrifices flexibility for more spell slots, which I think goes somewhat against the goal of the class. The Artificer, to me, is a maverick who is somewhat ready for any situation. Keeping them as a prepared spellcaster helps with this, but the fact that they only get to prepare a very small number of spells every day makes them somewhat limited in terms of utility. In short, I want an Artificer who feels more like a Rogue and less like a Sorcerer.

I don't think they should be compared to a sorcerer or wizard (even though I did earlier) in terms of spell power. I think they should be compared to a warlock. In general, they seem to have a few spells less than the warlock does--but unlike the warlock (but like the cleric), they appear to have access to their entire spell list and can switch out daily, rather than changing one spell each time they go up a level. And, of course, there's a good chance they can cast each spell multiple times without fizzling out or having to take a short rest.

So I think the real question is, do their non-spell abilities compliment their spellcasting enough? I think so, barring the exceptions I noted in my original post, but I'm not an expert in class balance. I still would give the Bombardier things to spend inventions on.

 

[Stalker0]

Wow I had started doing the math but looking at those number, they don't need to reroll 1s, and I don't even know if they need the die type to increase.

I updated the math once again. I was using approximate calculations for the spell slots before as I figured they would be sufficient for this simple analysis, but I realized that at the very low %s it was actually pretty inaccurate. So this time I used true geometric series (this is actually a very simple series with a very easy solution, I feel silly for not doing it earlier it was actually easier to do than the approximation).

You'll find that the number of 1st level slots the artificer can cast at higher levels is MUCH higher than I recorded before.

 

[xiphumor]

For ease of discussion, here are the failure chances for the various fizzle die and spell levels.

UPDATE: I have now added the average number of castings you would get for a spell of that level per day per spell invention.

% Chance (average spell slots per spell invention of that level)


d4
1 - 25% (3.83)
2 - 50% (2)
3 - 75% (1.33)

d6
1 - 16.7% (5.2)
2 - 33.3% (3)
3 - 50% (2)
4 - 66.7% (1.5)
5 - 83.3% (1.2)

d6 (reroll)
1 - 2.8% (9.6)
2 - 22.2% (4.2)
3 - 41.7% (2.4)
4 - 61.1% (1.6)
5 - 80.6% (1.24)

d8 (reroll)
1 - 1.6% (10.2)
2 - 15.6% (5.4)
3 - 29.7% (3.3)
4 - 43.8% (2.3)
5 - 57.8% (1.7)

d10 (reroll)
1 - 1% (10.5)
2- 12% (6.3)
3 - 23% (4.1)
4 - 34% (2.9)
5 - 45% (2.2)

To add to this, here an expanded table of basically the same concept. Each box shows the likelihood of fizzling after rolling X many times

d4	Times used
Levels 1-9	1	2	3	4	5
1	25.00%	43.75%	57.81%	68.36%	76.27%
2	50.00%	75.00%	87.50%	93.75%	96.88%
3	75.00%	93.75%	98.44%	99.61%	99.90%
d6	times used
Level 10	1	2	3	4	5
1	16.67%	30.56%	42.13%	51.77%	59.81%
2	33.33%	55.56%	70.37%	80.25%	86.83%
3	50.00%	75.00%	87.50%	93.75%	96.88%
4	66.67%	88.89%	96.30%	98.77%	99.59%
5	83.33%	97.22%	99.54%	99.92%	99.99%
d6 (reroll)	Times used
Level 10	1	2	3	4	5
1	2.78%	5.48%	8.10%	10.66%	13.14%
2	22.22%	39.51%	52.95%	63.40%	71.54%
3	41.67%	65.97%	80.15%	88.42%	93.25%
4	61.11%	84.88%	94.12%	97.71%	99.11%
5	80.56%	96.22%	99.26%	99.86%	99.97%
d8 (reroll)	Times Used
Level 20	1	2	3	4	5
1	1.56%	3.10%	4.61%	6.11%	7.57%
2	15.63%	28.81%	39.93%	49.32%	57.24%
3	29.69%	50.56%	65.24%	75.56%	82.81%
4	43.75%	68.36%	82.20%	89.99%	94.37%
5	57.81%	82.20%	92.49%	96.83%	98.66%
d10 (reroll)	Times Used
Special	1	2	3	4	5
1	1.00%	1.99%	2.97%	3.94%	4.90%
2	12.00%	22.56%	31.85%	40.03%	47.23%
3	23.00%	40.71%	54.35%	64.85%	72.93%
4	34.00%	56.44%	71.25%	81.03%	87.48%
5	45.00%	69.75%	83.36%	90.85%	94.97%

 

[Stalker0]

So an idea. I haven't done any math on it yet, but since LU has introduced this new countdown mechanic, what if the artificer used it?

Lets say the Artificer had a pool of d6s every day. And every time their device was used, you made a countdown check, and remove each d6 whose value was equal or less than the spell slot used.

Once the Artificer's die ran out, it was out of juice.


Example: Lets say the Artificier has 4 d6s currently. They cast a 2nd level spell. We roll the 4 d6s, getting a 1,2,4,6. The 1 and 2 are equal or lower than the spell slot (2) and so are removed. Going forward, the artificier now has 2 d6 remaining.

Obviously you could have mechanics that maybe reroll die in the pool or refresh them or XYZ.

It mainly just came to mind because I really like the countdown mechanic, so it seems like a cool idea to use it in a class.

 

[Anselm]

Magical Buff Class
My biggest issue is the number of prepared spells. It just feels so low compared to other classes.

Could someone explain why they think this? The O5E artificer has the following total number of spells prepared assuming point buy and maxing int ASAP:

Level	O5E	A5E
3	6	4
5	10	7
10	16	10
14	20	13

Sure there is a difference but the gulf is not so wide that it seems problematic and if the difference is there to balance out the upgraded power and number of castings added by the fizzle die (not to mention fun and uniqueness it brings to the class) I think it's well worth it. After level ten the possibility of simply not running out of level one or possibly level two spells for the day seems very useful. Given you will always have 4 of those prepared you can spend your flexible prepared spells on some bigger guns with some gamble that you'll be able to cast them more than once. That seems like a fun as hell design to me.