Pleaz your ideas for this devious spell

[plavi]

Guys,

I would really like your opinion on this following spell I concocted. The story behind it:
A big bad Überdemon (henceforth called the BBÜ) is happily doing his corrupting evil things on the world. The heroes have however gotten scent of him and are chasing him, slaying his minions, etcetera (any similarities to you, innocent DM's out there?).
The fact that they are destroying his minions doesn't bother him too much (todays minion can be tomorrows rival) but they are getting so powerful that there may be an odd chance of them ever becoming powerful enough to hurt him. So, he will send out his minions and order them to do the following spell on the heroes (through the maggot).

Fatebind
Necromancy
Level: Wiz/Sor6
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 round
Range: Touch
Target: Creature touched
Duration: Permanent
Saving Throw: Fort
Spell Resistance: Yes
This spell creates a link between the caster of the spell and the recipient, any physical damage or healing that happens to the caster happens also to the recipient, and vice versa.
A live maggot is enchanted at the casting of the spell, and must be used within 24 hours. This maggot, either by the caster or by someone else, is held to the victims ear, and that crawls in and nests itself magically in the victims brain. Hence, this spell can only be done when the victim is willing, sleeping, held, dominated, etcetera. The victim then makes a Fort save. If it is succesfull, the maggott fails to enter the victim's brain. Failure means the victim is now fatebount to the caster until a Wish/Miracle is cast. A remove curse done by a priest of at least the level of the caster kills the maggot and ends the spell.
Multiple castings of this spell will bind the caster to multiple people; he will <...???...>. Needless to say, this is a dangerous spell with possibly undesired side-effects such as.... <...???...>

However, I need some more ideas, so I was hoping you would use all your deviousness and inspiration and help me develop this spell that, though of course evil and bad, is fair and fitting and proper etcetera.

What School(s) should I make it.?
Which caster level? Death6? Evil5? Etc..
Any more ways to remove it? (Limited wish? Heal?)
What effect? Just damage/healing is the most simple?
What would happen if the caster or the victim died? (If the victim dies the caster loses a level? A con point? Save or die?)
What if multiple victims died? (If all these victims are dead, the caster dies unless he saves vs fort?)
Side-effects?

Any ideas are welcome...

 

[Michael Morris]

First off, at 6th level it's too powerful. Compare to this...

Sirrom’s Pain Link
Necromancy
Level: Black 5, Pain 6
Components: V, S
Casting Time: One Action
Range: Personal
Effect: Creatures attacking you.
Duration: 1 round / level
Saving Throw: Fort 1/2
Spell Resistance: Yes

“Las graci dol al requen” – Liternanin for “The Gift is always received.”

When a creature deals damage to you by any means, damage of the same amount is dealt to it in the form of negative energy. They gain a saving throw to reduce this to half.

For example, if you are hit by an enemy fireball spell and it deals 20 points to you, its caster will take 20 points of damage, fortitude save for half.

If an area of effect attack triggers multiple instances of this spell, only the strongest damage result returns to the creature.

For example, if a dragon breaths on three wizards with this spell for 40 points of damage, and two make their saving throw for ½ and one doesn’t, the dragon is subject to 40 points of damage (the strongest damage result), fortitude save for half.

As with all negative energy, this spell heals undead.

----

Now, if that effect is added to a two way Shield Other it's at least an 8th level spell while staying at 1 round / level. Making it permanent would require the permanency spell and some serious XP.

 

[Geoff Watson]

That's very similar to the Fate Link psionic power.

It's only 3rd level, doesn't require a helpless victim, doesn't require the caster to be a target, but isn't permanent, and much easier to get rid of.

I would remove the helpless victim requirement and reduce the casting time to 1 action so the minions actually get a chance to use it.

Geoff.

 

[plavi]

@Michael_Morris
Thanks for this comparison of spells, it is kinda strange however. AoE: all creatures attacking you?. What if you were attacked from 400 feet away with a ray of disintegration? Quite an AoE I'd say.

However, it bring up some interesting points: the idea of adding an XP cost for it ot be permanent I hadn't though of yet, I'll certainly include that.

Also, since it DOES work 2 ways, it is actually a worse spell than the one you are describing, for the caster also gets damage if he damages the victim. If it'd work one way, then 8th or 9th level surely, but..... <brainwave> what if I combined this spell, that will deal negative energy damage, with a protection from negative energy damage spell?</brainwave>

The point of the spell is, in the final great encounter the heroes should plunge their swords in their own hearts, thereby killing the BBÜ and themselves floating up to Heaven, having saved the world and becoming legendary heroes (for which being dead is a prerequisite)

But please, keep on shooting at it, I'm open for ANY suggestion.... ;-)

Regards

 

[MarauderX]

What about the Bind spell in the PHB? Lure one of the characters into a trap by the nasties, then lay that on him.

I know you are shooting for the big ending thing, but the Bind spell is pretty heavy and high level - i would increase the spell you first described up to 9th level as it has a lot of bad conotations if you fail your FORT save. The casting time is only 1 round (!), for that alone it should be higher level. It is also permanent. This says a lot for a spell, and for the PCs to know a worm entrained with evil magic is somewhere in their brain...
Yup, 9th level. Gotta be, IMO.

I love the concept, though and I was thinking it could be done some other way, such as having the demon and characters switch souls, but this spell could be modified to work how you want it for your campaign, especially if only Mr. Demon gets to use it.

I would think the caster could only be bound to one being at a time.
Any more ways to remove it?
Limited Wish does miracles, and it should work here to cancel this spell.

What would happen if the caster or the victim died?
My feeling on the relationship is one-sided: if the caster dies, the victim dies; if the victim dies, the caster loses 1 CON point.

Now, if that effect is added to a two way Shield Other it's at least an 8th level spell while staying at 1 round / level. Making it permanent would require the permanency spell and some serious XP
I never like to see spells (or anything for that matter) with an XP cost, and not here either.

Now what purpose would this spell eventually serve? The victim is naturally going to want the spell removed, and will seek out the caster. However the caster would most likely be trying to stay out of harms way from the victim without killing him in order to save himself from any self-induced damage. No matter what, for the caster it's a loosing situation to cast this spell as long as it does damage to him as well.

As for being bound to each other, would the one with the most HPs win? Or is it just a perctage of the HPs to one another?

 

[Khorod]

This spell strikes me as a serious ritual. Maybe the maggot is the focus of the spell, and it takes multiple hours to prepare. It will then remain ready for another 24 hours.

And maybe during this time if the maggot dies the wizard does? (That's just cool flavor...)

If you are using the Ritual system from Relics and Rituals, this is like a True Ritual 6 or so.

 

[DreamChaser]

I would do it like this ... just my suggestions.

Fateworm
Transmutation
Level: Wiz/Sor7
Components: V, S, M, F
Casting Time: 1 hour
Range: Touch
Target: 1 maggot
Duration: Permanent
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: Yes

This spell alters an ordinary maggot to become a vessel for a unidirectional fate link that can be inflicted upon a creature by introduction into a living creature.

The fateworm must be held to the victims ear, allowing it to crawl in and nest itself magically in the victim's brain. This can only be done when the victim is willing, sleeping, held, dominated, etc and requires one full round. If the victim of the fateworm is the recipent of a remove disease spell, then the fateworm is killed (see below).

This spell creates a link between the caster of the spell and the recipient, any physical damage or healing that happens to the caster happens also to the host of the fateworm. Only a wish or limited wish can free a victim from a fateworm, although a dispel magic targeted on the fateworm within the victim will supress the magic. A Mordenkainen's Disjunction has a chance to disenchant (and kill) the fateworm.

The live maggot that is enchanted at the casting of the spell must be used within 24 hours or it dies. If (for any reason) the fateworm is killed, the caster must make a fortitude save (DC 19) or die. Even if the save is successful, the caster permanently loses 2 points of constitution. The only way to end a fateworm without suffering a risk of death is to kill the victim.

The focus of this spell is a live maggot; the material compentents are a drop of blood from a twin creature, and 5,000 gp worth of speical chemicals.

 

[Khorod]

What would happen if a character fatebound/wormed/etc a troll, slapped permanent protections from acid and fire, and kept the thing locked in his basement?

 

[DreamChaser]

What would happen if a character fatebound/wormed/etc a troll, slapped permanent protections from acid and fire, and kept the thing locked in his basement?

This isn't a wound transfer. Its a sympathetic link. The bearer or the fateworm takes damage but so does the caster. It is not a lifesaver, it is a deterant. "Hah hah. If you attack me you hurt the king too!"

Actually, you're idea would be horrably dangerous for the caster because he would have very little way (short of starving) of killing the troll, which is his only way out of the spell.

 

[Khorod]

This spell creates a link between the caster of the spell and the recipient, any physical damage or healing that happens to the caster happens also to the recipient, and vice versa.

Originally posted by dreamchaster
any physical damage or healing that happens to the caster happens also to the host of the fateworm
This isn't a wound transfer.

I guess I am reading the healing part wrong...
my point was would regeneration carry over? How about fatelinking someone, keeping them at home, and whenever they inexplicably get hurt pouring some potions of healing into them?

These spells don't say it has to be the character on the other end of the link doing the healing/harming, and it doesn't specify that the damage that carries over can't be healed...

Actually, you're idea would be horrably dangerous for the caster because he would have very little way (short of starving) of killing the troll, which is his only way out of the spell.

Of course it would be dangerous, but if the trolls regen heals him, its a risky form of invincibility.

And as a permanent spell, other ways out of this include break enchantment, dispell magic, mordenkainen's disjunction, or if you're feeling like overkill, limited wish or wish. EDIT: On looking back, I see you included these options. But why then the starvation comment? He could go down into his basement, cast dispel magic (and if I recall, as his own spell its an automatic success), and free the thing. or just leave it there.

I'm just looking at the loopholes the wording of the spells seem to create...