Points of Light and the Forgotten Realms

Alright, now we can all be on even footing discussing this . . .

The Orc King Sample Chapter

I think that its a bit strange to have such wide ranging comments if this isn't the set up for the new FRCS, and I also think its another reason to be a bit dubious of WOTC promises, i.e. Points of Light not really applying to the Realms.
 

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Rich Baker said:
we're not going to overthrow worlds with that much breadth and history.

But ....

The Orc King said:
“I have ventured outside of the Silver Marches,” Drizzt said, “have you? I
have witnessed the death of once-proud Luskan, and with it, the death of a
dear, dear friend, whose dreams lay shattered and broken beside the bodies of
five thousand victims. I have watched the greatest cathedral in the world burn
and collapse. I witnessed the hope of the goodly drow, the rise of the followers
of Eilistraee. But where are they now?”

“You speak in ridd—” the elf started, but Drizzt slammed him again.

“Gone!” Drizzt shouted. “Gone, and gone with them the hopes of a tamed
and gentle world. I have watched once safe trails revert to wilderness, and have
walked a dozen-dozen communities that you will never know. They are gone
now, lost to the Spellplague or worse! Where are the benevolent gods? Where
is the refuge from the tumult of a world gone mad? Where are the candles to
chase away the darkness?”

“They are here, those lights of hope,” Drizzt said, to both elves. “In the Silver
Marches. Or they are nowhere. Do we choose peace or do we choose war? If it
is battle you seek, fool elf, then get you gone from this land. You will find death
aplenty, I assure you. You will find ruins where once proud cities stood. You
will find fields of wind-washed bones, or perhaps the remains of a single hearth,
where once an entire village thrived.

“And in that hundred years of chaos, amidst the coming of darkness, few
have escaped the swirl of destruction, but we have flourished. Can you say the
same for Thay? Mulhorand? Sembia? You say I betray those who befriended me,
yet it was the vision of one exceptional dwarf and one exceptional orc that built
this island against the roiling sea.”

Either Rich Baker does not conform to the common usage of English of "not overthrow", or he doesn't know what he's talking about. There's chance that RAS just wrote all that on a lark, and no one at WotC editing objected to it .... but I don't think that's too likely.

The common phrase defining chaos and change is 'cats and dogs, living together.' Elves, Dwarves and orcs standing as allies? Orcs standing for law and peace, defending the last outposts of 'civilization'? That's even stranger. In fact, it's unrecognizable to me.
 

I'm just glad there isn't any evidence of D&D becoming more like Warcraft. I mean, for that you would have to have orcs that get along with other races . . . :confused:

Hm . . . I wonder if Thay is going to end up being populated by not entirely evil undead as well?
 

KnightErrantJR said:
I'm just glad there isn't any evidence of D&D becoming more like Warcraft. I mean, for that you would have to have orcs that get along with other races . . . :confused:

Hm . . . I wonder if Thay is going to end up being populated by not entirely evil undead as well?


It does seem that the Realms will go through some turmoil, but we still don't know when the next Realms campaign book will be set.

I can easily see Thay falling into civil war, or Mulhorand and Thay fighting a war that leaves each other in pieces. (This would mirror some aspects of Egyptian history, which is fitting for Mulhorand.)

So, the books may present what is a "Dark Realms" future independent of the next campaign book or may preview it. The Realms have not been presented as going through a long term crisis, so doing so for the campaign book might work.

Some of the favorite places and NPCs could remain. I would argue that part of the problem Elminster faces besides being powerful is that he was introduced as the Sage of the Realms and not one of the heroes. Also, there would be a ready explanation why Alustriel, Elminster, and several others aren't out doing the things the heroes are doing. If they are alive, they are probably trying to keep some portion of the Realms relatively safe.
 

Who's to say the contents of that book isn't just foreshadowing a possible future, rather than the official canon for the 4th edition Realms?

I will say, though, that if the Realms get that big an overhaul, then the setting's fans are going to be screwed on an even bigger scale than the fans of Greyhawk, Mystara, and Dark Sun...
 

Irda Ranger said:
Either Rich Baker does not conform to the common usage of English of "not overthrow", or he doesn't know what he's talking about. There's chance that RAS just wrote all that on a lark, and no one at WotC editing objected to it .... but I don't think that's too likely.

The common phrase defining chaos and change is 'cats and dogs, living together.' Elves, Dwarves and orcs standing as allies? Orcs standing for law and peace, defending the last outposts of 'civilization'? That's even stranger. In fact, it's unrecognizable to me.

That's an interesting section. I wonder to what extent someone like Salvatore guides the structure of the Realms, and to what extent he follows it.

I'd imagine that WotC does and should let their most popular writers take the lead in this regard -- after all, the reason they're popular is that they somehow tap into what readers find appealing about the fiction. But I'm curious to what extent -- for instance, if that story does match the new points of light setting concept, did the story lead the FRCS change, or the FRCS change lead the story?

Also, I know they've got other stars as well. Does anyone have an idea of how the various authors break out?
 

I have to admit the thought of FR as a magical wasteland does have some appeal............

If FR is kicked back about three orders of magnitude on the power and overreaching plots scales, I might become interested in it.

Which it might in 4E

I am looking at it
 

tylerthehobo said:
WWEGD? What would Ed Greenwood Do?

That is an interesting point. I plan on asking Ed the next time I talk to him (assuming he can answer). I may not be able to tell anyone but at least I'll know. :)
 

Here is another quote for the sample chapter that is revealing.

His perspective and memories of that time a hundred years gone, before the
rise of the Empire of Netheril, the coming of the aboleths, and the discordant
and disastrous joining of two worlds

Rise of Netheril suggests that the return of the city of Shade is a foreshadowing of some sort of victory of the Shadowvar. Perhaps the Spellplague only affects Weave users, which might be the reason the Shadowvar became ascendant.

Coming of the Aboleths.... some sort of aboleth invasion?

Discordant and disastrous joining to two worlds? Is a figurative or literal event? World as in two different cultures or is it more literal, as two different physicalities joining?

I'm sorry but the words of Rich Baker and the limited information gleaned from the sample chapter of the Orc King are at odds. Looks to me like the big campaign world reset button was pushed.

"...we're not going to overthrow worlds with that much breadth and history." :confused:
 

BlackMoria said:
Here is another quote for the sample chapter that is revealing.



Rise of Netheril suggests that the return of the city of Shade is a foreshadowing of some sort of victory of the Shadowvar. Perhaps the Spellplague only affects Weave users, which might be the reason the Shadowvar became ascendant.

Coming of the Aboleths.... some sort of aboleth invasion?

Discordant and disastrous joining to two worlds? Is a figurative or literal event? World as in two different cultures or is it more literal, as two different physicalities joining?

I'm sorry but the words of Rich Baker and the limited information gleaned from the sample chapter of the Orc King are at odds. Looks to me like the big campaign world reset button was pushed.

"...we're not going to overthrow worlds with that much breadth and history." :confused:


Well, one could perhaps say that the coming of the Shade could be considered a joining of the two worlds. However, it may mena something else.
 

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