Power sources. What's the point?

[ryryguy]

I hope not. These power sources seem arbitrary and make so little sense that I'm glad they don't have any effect (not that the roles make much sense to me either)

And such feats would have to take into account all the classes that may or may not come for each power source.

Yeah, is it the case that the power sources are not used as keywords in the first books at all? (I don't have them.)

It does seem like they could be used that way, but I agree that it might open a can of worms. The design seems to be so carefully balanced among the classes, and starting to add stuff based on the power sources could jeopordize that. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it would have to be done carefully and effects keying off them would likely have to be pretty minor.

Design guideline seems like the primary purpose for sure.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

To sell more books. Each new power source is an additional $40 book they can sell you.

You don't need power sources for that. 3E did create dozens of books without introducing new power sources.
Off course, power sources can be helpful to guide the creation of interesting new material...


Power Source is essentially "flavor", and if you design new powers, it should fit the flavor associated with the power source.

Some guidelines might be
o Martial:
- Typically attacks AC
- deals physical damage
- relies on weapons
- often modifies your movement

o Arcana
- Does typically not attack AC
- deals energy types of damage
- causes lasting effects (zones, conjurations, save ends, debuffs)
- relies in implements

o Divine
- often deals radiant damage
- relies on implements

o Psionic (Guess)
- often deals psychic damage
- affects the mind

 

[lutecius]

Yeah, is it the case that the power sources are not used as keywords in the first books at all? (I don't have them.)

They don't seem to have any effect whatsoever. For example, Spell Focus only works for wizard spells, even the though warlock powers are called spells too.
Dispel Magic works on Conjurations and Zones, regardless of power source.

You don't need power sources for that. 3E did create dozens of books without introducing new power sources.
Off course, power sources can be helpful to guide the creation of interesting new material...

I don't think considerations like "what should the martial controller be?" would make such interesting new material. The classes should be based on evocative archetypes. We already have enough nonsensical powers arising directly from role/source combinations rather than actual genre conventions.

Power Source is essentially "flavor", and if you design new powers, it should fit the flavor associated with the power source. [...]
o Arcana
- Does typically not attack AC
- deals energy types of damage
- causes lasting effects (zones, conjurations, save ends, debuffs)
- relies in implements

If the Bard is the next arcane class, I hope he won't be focused on energy damage. Conversely I am afraid the Sorcerer will be yet another blaster, even without being arcane.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

They don't seem to have any effect whatsoever. For example, Spell Focus only works for wizard spells, even the though warlock powers are called spells too.
Dispel Magic works on Conjurations and Zones, regardless of power source.
I don't think considerations like "what should the martial controller be?"

If it's just about filling a grid, I agree.
But concepts like "Primal" or "Psionic" definitely describe something new and interesting.

would make such interesting new material. The classes should be based on evocative archetypes. We already have enough nonsensical powers arising directly from role/source combinations rather than actual genre conventions.

Do we?

If the Bard is the next arcane class, I hope he won't be focused on energy damage. Conversely I am afraid the Sorcerer will be yet another blaster, even without being arcane.

Since that is what he mostly was in 3E, I think that what he will be in 4E. There is a strong implication it might be stronger linked to "Wild Mage" then "Wizard". Maybe something "Primal"?

(not that the roles make much sense to me either)

Roles never made sense, because there was never someone best suited to holding off attacks, while others strike from distance or otherwise avoid staying close to their enemies, some buff their allies, or some heal their allies, or some attack groups of enemies at once?

There was never a role-playing game that had roles classes like Cleric, Fighting Man, Magic-User and Thief.

 

[med stud]

I think Mearls stated that the reason behind the power sources is to keep a certain style to the powers of a class. Since the powers of all classes are supposed to be balanced now, it's critical that designers don't cross the lines to another power source.

It's like Magic the Gathering. They have some kind of document with the "essence" of each colour to make sure that each colour has a distinct taste despite thousands of cards being released.

 

[Spenser]

It's a way to try to stop ridiculous trolls claiming that everyone is a caster now, because everyone has powers. Everyone has powers, but not all powers are magical, they have other sources.

This. And -- sssh! Derren is busy complaining about fire resistance of all things, don't let him latch on to this one.

 

[Pssthpok]

I think it would be neat to run a "classless" D&D, whereby players select powers for their PC from one power source (rather than a class list of powers), with multiclass training feats opening up new power sources.

Then, things would get really interesting, and still be ostensibly just as balanced.

 

[RangerWickett]

In the original Magic: the Gathering, creature type almost didn't matter. Now it matters a lot. You give yourself a lot of design space so you can play around in it later.

 

[Harr]

Future material released will make stronger use of the distinction between power sources, I'm sure.

Imagine your fighter's face when he walks into his first anti-martial field.

 

[doctorhook]

Power source has some mechanical effects; for example, the wizard's spellbook. Wizards can learn additional daily and utility spells beyond what they can use in a day, thanks to their spellbook class feature. As I understand it, if a Wizard multiclasses as another Arcane class, (ie: Warlock), the Wizard can use his daily and utility Warlock spells in conjunction with his spellbook class feature. In contrast, he couldn't use his spellbook with any daily or utility exploits or prayers he'd have learned from multiclassing into a Divine or Martial class.

I'm sure there are other examples, and that there will be more in future products, but this was the first example I thought of. Certainly, power sources have at least a little mechanical basis.