Pramas on the OGL

[xechnao]

His argument presumes the customer is completely incapable of making a judgment of quality for themself.

Everything has a price to be paid. Even the ability to make a judgment and thus this ability is not guaranteed. If it were, shops would sell out their stuff and stock all the time.

 

[BryonD]

Everything has a price to be paid. Even the ability to make a judgment and thus this ability is not guaranteed. If it were, shops would sell out their stuff and stock all the time.

I've never met a person that was not able to judge for themselves what they liked. Your suggestion that this is in debate seems quite absurd.

I'm not sure what to make of your last sentence because it seems to infer an absolute idea of a "right" value. One aspect of the anti-OGL position seems to be a complete disregard for the concept of YMMV. It seems that because YOU didn't like it, somehow the concept of anyone liking it is beyond fathoming and is being discarded as a lack of judgment, since a different judgment is clearly impossible.

It is a deeply flawed analysis.

 

[BryonD]

It hurts me. Domino becomes a standard and the probabilities are that Domino will be the one to serve me when I get hungry.

Funny, there are lots of Dominos places around me. And yet by the crazy laws of probability I end up getting pizza from Papa Johns every time. Weird.

 

[xechnao]

I've never met a person that was not able to judge for themselves what they liked. Your suggestion that this is in debate seems quite absurd.

I'm not sure what to make of your last sentence because it seems to infer an absolute idea of a "right" value. One aspect of the anti-OGL position seems to be a complete disregard for the concept of YMMV. It seems that because YOU didn't like it, somehow the concept of anyone liking it is beyond fathoming and is being discarded as a lack of judgment, since a different judgment is clearly impossible.

It is a deeply flawed analysis.

You did not get my point. I was talking about shops in general. My argument was that shops which stock by judgment are not reliable about themselves. Judgment is not something reliable in economy. Economists need to make judgment calls only in front of a dead ends and these calls are considered unreliable too.

Funny, there are lots of Dominos places around me. And yet by the crazy laws of probability I end up getting pizza from Papa Johns every time. Weird.

This is anecdotal. Markets get measured with analysis -not with judgment as judgment is not enough. If it were Dominos or other low quality branches would not out be there. But they still are and dominate the market.


Overall your point is that market problems can and perhaps must be fixed by consumers. This is just not true.

 

[fissionessence]

Overall your point is that market problems can and perhaps must be fixed by consumers. This is just not true.

If Domino's and other what you perceive to be 'low-quality' pizza places are truly flooding the market, then it is because a majority of people have selected that standard of pizza as their favorite. Consumers have determined that they prefer lower costs to high quality product, and thus their perception of quality is not so much based on the pizza itself, but rather on a cost-to-quality ration, with preference leaning heavily toward low cost.

In order for this example to apply to the D20 OGL market, the same consumer preference for "low cost over quality" would have to apply . . . and I'm not convinced it does. Consumers always fix the market. If they do not buy a product, similar products cease to be made. In the pizza example, a consumer may choose a cheap pizza over a thick and tasty one. However, in an OGL PDF market, I would expect consumers to choose products that actually appeal to them in terms of quality and content, and therefore lower-quality products would not be purchased, and henceforth not be made, thus virtually ridding the market of crap. It's much more conceivable to buy a pizza that can be 'good enough' than it is to continuously purchase crappy PDFs that one would never use.

~ fissionessence

 

[2WS-Steve]

Funny, there are lots of Dominos places around me. And yet by the crazy laws of probability I end up getting pizza from Papa Johns every time. Weird.

Me too! Our ability to mold reality around us such that we actually choose what pizzas we buy truly makes us gods among men!

Please join me in a league of evil mutants.

 

[xechnao]

If Domino's and other what you perceive to be 'low-quality' pizza places are truly flooding the market, then it is because a majority of people have selected that standard of pizza as their favorite. Consumers have determined that they prefer lower costs to high quality product, and thus their perception of quality is not so much based on the pizza itself, but rather on a cost-to-quality ration, with preference leaning heavily toward low cost.

In order for this example to apply to the D20 OGL market, the same consumer preference for "low cost over quality" would have to apply . . . and I'm not convinced it does. Consumers always fix the market. If they do not buy a product, similar products cease to be made. In the pizza example, a consumer may choose a cheap pizza over a thick and tasty one. However, in an OGL PDF market, I would expect consumers to choose products that actually appeal to them in terms of quality and content, and therefore lower-quality products would not be purchased, and henceforth not be made, thus virtually ridding the market of crap. It's much more conceivable to buy a pizza that can be 'good enough' than it is to continuously purchase crappy PDFs that one would never use.

~ fissionessence

Not in capitalism. When capitalism works as it should consumers just need. They are not the ones to determine costs-never happened in capitalism. Consumer favor, preference and standards are put in place by businesses by exploiting the overall conditions: this is just the power of capital in capitalism -it is how capitalism works.

EDIT: By all means I do not believe that capitalism is good nor I am in favor of it. But this is what we are facing right now.

 

[xechnao]

Me too! Our ability to mold reality around us such that we actually choose what pizzas we buy truly makes us gods among men!

Please join me in a league of evil mutants.

I am an evil mutant too.

 

[carmachu]

As I said before, the OGL put plenty of products on the shelves. But it put good and bad products on the shelf. It didn't provide consumers with any tools to determine which OGL products were good and which were bad.

Wotc too, who owns the brand, put plenty of products on the shelf that were both good and bad, and there were no tools to determine which were good and which were bad......oh wait, there were, wernt there? It was called flip through the book and decide for yourself.

Your point is silly. ALL companies, from WotC down, put out good and not so good products in 3.5....hell even Monte's company had a few dogs.

 

[xechnao]

Wotc too, who owns the brand, put plenty of products on the shelf that were both good and bad, and there were no tools to determine which were good and which were bad......oh wait, there were, wernt there? It was called flip through the book and decide for yourself.

Your point is silly. ALL companies, from WotC down, put out good and not so good products in 3.5....hell even Monte's company had a few dogs.

His point is not silly even if you don't think of the quantity of products put out by Wotc and the percentage of those that were considered good. Fact is that Wotc was considered the market leader. If it were not for Wotc's D20 none of the products would have had the value they have had (even 3rd party).