PrC: Arcane Valet (extended Pirate edition)

[TheUber]

Would it be ok if I put this PrC on my website?
http://www.uberddragons.cjb.net/

 

[bret]

this is basically an assistant or henchman type class. if you want to playone thats fine. but its basically an NPC class like an expert which would make for a natural progression into the Valet PrC.

Its basically the same as playing the squire rather then the knight. that's why I see it as an NPC class. now having said that I have played in several games where people took levels in commoner, expert or noble. so I am by no means trying to limit this class to NPC's just trying to make it clear that since that is who most valets will be drawn from (even the really good ones) that they should be able to qualify for it without having to take adventuring levels

Thank you for the reply.

I think this PrC would be overpowered for a follower/NPC class. I could see using it for a cohort, but not anything less.

I also don't agree with your analogy about the knight and squire. The squire is a youngster, still in apprenticeship. A valet is a grown man, not a serving boy.

If there can be a PrC for a bodyguard (Devoted Defender, Sword and Fist, WotC), why not for the Valet that is always at his master's side.

As for being heroic, that would depend on what you do. I would say that fighting off kraken, trying to uncover a smuggling ring, and repelling Koatoa boarders would all be appropriate tasks for a hero. They are all things that my character has had to help with.

In any case, if the only reason that people are saying this is an NPC PrC is the job then there is nothing I can fix.

[ Edit: Cut redundent sentence about Devoted Defender ]

 

[Sanackranib]

I think that this is a really good idea for a PrC. There is a PrC for a squire in the quint. Paladin, and you are right that is definatly a cohort.
however in a game where there are various stations, ie: nobleity
using the analagy that you made to Alfread etc. this class would be more of a hireling then a cohoet. that isn't to say that he/she wouldn't be loyal to the employer but rather that they are paid to be.

the fact that you are playing a PC is irrilivent to the "design" of this class. do you see this as a class that PC's will take or NPC's will take for the most part. since both can take it then the requirements should be able to be met by PC classes as well as NPC classes. just as they would be for a knights squire. thats why I would like to see the spell requirements changed. this should not be somthing that most commoners would ever aspire to but there is a demand for these professionals among the rich and powerfull. I see them as 1 type of expert, so its natural that MOST would be drawn from that class. your PC is an exception to the rule. I am not trying to downplay your character but rather get you to take a step back and look at it from a slightly differnt class.

let me say again, that I really like the idea and I like what you have done with it.

 

[bret]

I think that this is a really good idea for a PrC. There is a PrC for a squire in the quint. Paladin, and you are right that is definatly a cohort.
[...snip...]
let me say again, that I really like the idea and I like what you have done with it.

Thanks again for the complements.

I'll think on what you've said, but it is unlikely that I will adapt it for use by the NPC classes. The reasons include:

• My original concept also had them using arcane rather than divine spellcasting. Since there isn't an NPC class that casts arcane spells, this isn't a good fit.
• Having read the background material for Amn in the Forgotten Realms, I thought that some of the very wealthy would pay quite a bit for a servant that could also work magic. Recruit a wizard's apprentice, life as a valet is likely to be less harsh than that of an apprentice.
• If the PrC is supposed to be appropriate for PCs, then it should be built like a PC class. The NPC classes tend to be weaker than the PC classes. As I said, I believe this would be overpowered for a follower but could work for a cohort.
• My understanding is that cohorts use the PC classes.
• The reason I went to all the effort of creating it was for use with a PC. I thought the idea was interesting and I wanted feedback on the balance aspects of it, which is why I posted it here.

Once again, I would like to thank you for your comments. It has helped me understand why many people probably haven't commented on the PrC. I'm sorry if I was a little abrupt, but it has been frustrating having people treat this as something strictly for use by NPCs.

It is hard to get people to talk about balance when something is seen as for use strictly by NPCs.

 

[Sanackranib]

for what its worth here are the changes that I propose to the AV PrC

Arcane Valet

"How may I be of service, sir?"

A good servant can improve the station of his employer. A truly exceptional person requires a level of service far beyond what any normal person could provide. It is these type of people who seek the service of an Arcane Valet. Most of the time it is an adventuring gentleman or lady who seeks such service. Since much of their time is spent in travel and dangerous pursuits, most servants would not be willing to serve such a master. The Arcane Valet learns to adapt to their master's needs, and anticipating them with uncanny accuracy.

Hit Die: d4

Requirements:
To qualify to become an Arcane Valet, a character must fulfill all of the following criteria:
Skills:
8 ranks Profession: Valet
5 ranks in two Craft, Profession, or Knowledge skills
Employed as a valet for at least one year

Class Skills:
Appraise, Balance, Bluff, Concentration, Craft, Decipher Script, Diplomacy, Gather Information, Innuendo, Knowledge(all), Listen, Profession, Read Lips, Sense Motive, Speak Languages, Spellcraft

In addition, the Arcane Valet can choose two additional skills to be class skills based on the needs of his employer. These skills are chosen when a person enters the prestige class and can not be changed after that. Examples could include:
Ship's Officer: Swim, Use Rope
Cavalry Officer: Handle Animals, Ride
Merchant Trader: Handle Animals, Intimidate
Criminal Mastermind: Alchemy, Escape Artist
Explorer: Wilderness Lore, Handle Animal

Skill points at each level: 4 + Int modifier

Starting at level 1 the Arcane Valet gains the ability to cast the following cantrips. Mage Hand, Mending, Prestidigitation, Unseen ServantLight,
At 3rd level this spell list is inhanced to include Quick Sobor and Detect Thoughts
The Arcane Valet is assumed to be a spellcaster of a level equal to his Arcane Valet level for the purposes of determining all spell effects.




Level..BAB..Fort..Refl..Will..Spells per Day....Special
........1....+0.....+0....+0...+2...............+1 level.Aways Properly Dressed
..................................................................Spellcasting
........2....+1.....+0....+0...+3.................+1 level....Kitchen Gossip
.....................................................................Supernatural Skill
........3....+1.....+1....+1...+3.................+1 level.... 1st Innate cantrip
.........................................................................Bardic Knowledge
........4....+2.....+1....+1...+4.........+1 level....Anticipate Master's Needs,
........5....+2.....+1....+1...+4.................+1 level.... 2nd Innate Cantrip

........6....+3.....+2....+2...+5.................+1 level....

........7....+3.....+2....+2...+5.................+1 level...Let Me Adjust That for You, 3rd Innate Cantrip

........8....+4.....+2....+2...+6.................+1 level....

........9....+4.....+3....+3...+6.................+1 level....4th Innate Cantrip

.......10...+5.....+3....+3...+7.................+1 level....Social Invisibility

Class Features:
Weapon and Armor Proficiency:
An Arcane Valet gains no additional proficiency in any weapons or armor.

Spells:
Starting at 1st level the Arcane Valet gains a limited ability to cast spells. These 0 level mage spell list cantrips help to make the Arcane Valet’s master a little more comfortable and the Arcane Valet’s job a little bit easier. At level 1 the valet picks 4 cantrips and gains a new one at the rate of 1 per 2 levels. The Arcane Valet can cast these spells once per day. At 3rd level, and every odd level thereafter one of these cantrips becomes an at will ability.

Always Properly Dressed (Su):
Regardless of weather, an Arcane Servant is always properly dressed if they are in their master's livery. They will not suffer any adverse effects from normal weather provided that they were the livery. It does not matter if it is woolen livery in the middle of the desert, or light Khakis in a blizzard, the Arcane Servant is able to ignore the environmental effects of normal weather.

Innate Cantrips (Sp):
You have cast some cantrips so many times to help you in your duties, it has become a natural part of you. This allows you to use certain cantrips (mainly Prestidigitation, Mending, maybe Mage Hand, Light, Detect Magic or others) as spell-like abilities at will.



Kitchen Gossip (Ex):
The Arcane Valet gains a +4 bonus to Gather Information checks from other servants. The valet is now part of the vast conspiracy of servants and can draw knowledge from it.

Supernatural Skill (Su):
You've learned how to integrate your arcane knowledge with your skill as a valet. You are now capable of using your skills as a valet to achieve extraordinary results. Any use of valet skill can achieve results just slightly beyond what would normally be allowed through mundane means. Examples:
1] Having your master's social calendar memorized, including the functions that you haven't been told about yet.
2] You have an eye and memory for detail, being able to rattle off the food preferences of your master and the people he associates or wants to associate with.
3] You can make any place feel a bit more comfortable for your master.
4] You are an expert at organizing parties and social events, taking care of the little details such as seating arrangements, food preferences, and making sure all the invitations get delivered properly.

Bardic Knowledge:
You never know when your employer may need to know that strange bit of trivia, so it is best to gather as much as possible. You never know when they may ask about such diverse topics as the proper form of address for the second cousin of the Pasha's sister, how long it takes a yellow-bellied sap sucker to fly across town, or what types of materials are favored by necromancers for their wands and staves. The Arcane Valet can make a Bardic Knowledge check (PHB 29) using his class level and Int Modifier. Levels in Arcane Valet stack with levels in any other class with the Bardic Knowledge class ability.

Anticipate Master's Needs (Su):
The supernatural ability to know when you will be needed, and sometimes know what items will be needed by your employer. "I thought you may be needing me/this..."

Let Me Adjust that for You (Ex):
Bonus to another's skill rolls, like Aid Another only the valet doesn't need to have the skill the person is using.

Social Invisibility (Ex):
No one pays any attention to a servant, especially in the company of their master.
The Arcane Valet can use their Profession: Valet skill to attempt to not be noticed by others. They make an opposed roll between their Profession: Valet skill and the opponents Spot skill. If they succeed, the other person ignored them.

Unless in the company of their master, attempting to go somewhere that servants are not normally allowed would incur a penalty to the Profession: Valet skill. Attempting to get into someplace where no one of their race is allowed would incur an additional penalty.
Acting in a manner unbecoming a servant (attacking someone with a sword, casting a Lighting Bolt at someone) will negate this ability.

The requirements have been lightened and the spellcasting abilities reduced. also the bonus feat has been removed. I still feel that the class is a bit front loaded but to change it further I feel would do more harm then it would good. I tried to maintain the flavor of the class while making it more accessable to NPC's. use it or don't thats my 2 cents worth.

 

[bret]

for what its worth here are the changes that I propose to the AV PrC
[ snip ]
Starting at level 1 the Arcane Valet gains the ability to cast the following cantrips. Mage Hand, Mending, Prestidigitation, Unseen ServantLight,
At 3rd level this spell list is inhanced to include Quick Sobor and Detect Thoughts
The Arcane Valet is assumed to be a spellcaster of a level equal to his Arcane Valet level for the purposes of determining all spell effects.

[ snip ]
Spells:
Starting at 1st level the Arcane Valet gains a limited ability to cast spells. These 0 level mage spell list cantrips help to make the Arcane Valet’s master a little more comfortable and the Arcane Valet’s job a little bit easier. At level 1 the valet picks 4 cantrips and gains a new one at the rate of 1 per 2 levels. The Arcane Valet can cast these spells once per day. At 3rd level, and every odd level thereafter one of these cantrips becomes an at will ability.

[ snip ]
The requirements have been lightened and the spellcasting abilities reduced. also the bonus feat has been removed. I still feel that the class is a bit front loaded but to change it further I feel would do more harm then it would good. I tried to maintain the flavor of the class while making it more accessable to NPC's. use it or don't thats my 2 cents worth.

If I were to take this approach, I would give them a completely separate spell list and progression. Take out the +1 level spellcasting at each level, instead give them a spellcasting progression of their own. I don't think it would matter to balance which way you went, Wizard or Sorcerer style caster.

I would have to look over the spell list, see what other spells I would include. I know that I would include Tenser's Floating Disk and Comprehend Languages. Since they have no armor proficiencies, also give them Mage Armor. If it went up to third level spells, I would include Tongues, Shrink, and Clairaudience/Clairvoyance. These are all spells I can name off the top of my head based on my own character's spell list.

It is doable, but not the concept that I was looking for.


One big question, where did Quick Sober come from? Is it a published spell in some supplement?


Personally, I think mine is a better fit for the Forgotten Realms. If someone would pay to have a company of soldiers to be waiters for their party, they would certainly pay to have a servant's child with the proper aptitude to be trained in arcane spellcasting and use them as a servant.

In Amn, social standing is all about how much money you have and how extravagant you are with your wealth. The more I think about it, the more convinced I am that for the Forgotten Realms there would be servants fully trained in wizardry or sorcery.



I would like to go back to discussing how to make the original PrC appropriate in power for use by a PC or cohort. That is why I posted my creation to this board, afterall.

 

[Knight-of-Roses]

bret,

In my opinion it is a fair and balanced PrC.

The only ideas floating around that I have at the moment are:

Silent or Still Spell as an additional feat requirement, as they should be able to use their magic with utmost subtly.

Spellcraft, 4+ ranks, to represent mastery of practical magic (for the Supernatural Skill ability).

Just as a flavor point, I would change the title of the Bardic Knowledge ability to, "Why, everyone knows, sir, that . . ." A bit long I know, but it captures the spirit so well.

Please send me a copy of whatever your finished version looks like.

 

[bret]

bret,

In my opinion it is a fair and balanced PrC.

The only ideas floating around that I have at the moment are:

Silent or Still Spell as an additional feat requirement, as they should be able to use their magic with utmost subtly.

I've been thinking about this since you first suggested it.

I like the idea of being able to use them on the fly. Provide the same ability as the metamatic feat rods. Allow the wizard or sorcerer to add them to a spell without any increase in spell level or casting time.

Judging from the Minitures Handbook preview, this is the direction that WotC is going too with the 'Sudden' Metamagic feats.

I would probably give it out as a limited number of times per day, going to 3x a day at 10th level.

Is it better to limit it to just the Silent & Still feats, or would it be overpowering to make it general? In any case, I should probably increase the prerequisites to include some sort of Metamagic feat.

Spellcraft, 4+ ranks, to represent mastery of practical magic (for the Supernatural Skill ability).

Sounds like a good idea, very appropriate.

Just as a flavor point, I would change the title of the Bardic Knowledge ability to, "Why, everyone knows, sir, that . . ." A bit long I know, but it captures the spirit so well.

I admit the only reason I called it Bardic Knowledge was for clarity.

Please send me a copy of whatever your finished version looks like.

Thanks for the feedback. I'll be sure to contact you when it is done.

 

[Sanackranib]

quick sobor is from the spells and spellcraft book. [it is refered to as sobor up in the pocket grimore.] its a cantrip or level 1 spell depending on the list it comes off of, that removes the effects of overindulgement of alchol and should be on the list for any proper gentlemans valet.

 

[bret]

Would it be ok if I put this PrC on my website?
http://www.uberddragons.cjb.net/

I sent you an e-mail but never got a response. I don't know if you received the e-mail or not.

I would prefer you just link to the HTML version of the PrC on my homepage.

http://www.io.com/~bret/seadogs/valet.html