Problem Players

[devilbat]

That thing where he comments about the size of the wizard's fireball should be met with a response like "Oh, how about this? *blam* It looks bigger from the inside, doesn't it?" .

LOL! I have to admit, that was my first thought, as wee. But, we have to keep in mind that the player in question is also prone to being pissy and bitter if something happens to his characters that he doesn't like.

Alright, here's my advice for dealing with your situation.

1) Don't allow multiple characters to be played by any one player. Make this a rule for everybody, across the table. All cohorts and henchman are to be played by the DM. Listening to this dude monopolize the game, roleplaying between his two characters must be annoying as hell for everyone involved.

2) Take a strong role in character creation. Don't be afraid to say "the extraplanar traveller in the guise of a monk, doesn't fit my campaign direction. Let's try something else". In my own game, I find it frustrating when characters who have supposed to have known each other for years, act like they've just met. So, I'll tell them that they're friends, and that I expect them to play that way. XP bonuses when they do, give them reasons to continue.

3) Make horrible things happen to the "explorer" when he pushes the line. You need to be careful with this one, as you don't want to quell the characters abilities to be free thinking, and explorative, but, you need to keep control of the game.

4) Have an NPC here and there that will stand up to the "explorer" character, and get him back in line. It sounds to me like he is the dominate personality of the group, and he is able to manipulate characters and situations to go his way. If you show the other players that he can be dealt with verbally, with an NPC that has a little gusto, they will likely follow suit and stand up to his railroading.

5) Don't blame one, for the sheep like reactions of the bunch. A leader, good or bad, leads. If the other characters are following the "explorer" into certain death, then death it is.

Thats all I can think for now (actually, I'm just tired of typing), so I look forward to your replies.

 

[W.Rose]

2) Take a strong role in character creation. Don't be afraid to say "the extraplanar traveller in the guise of a monk, doesn't fit my campaign direction. Let's try something else". In my own game, I find it frustrating when characters who have supposed to have known each other for years, act like they've just met. So, I'll tell them that they're friends, and that I expect them to play that way. XP bonuses when they do, give them reasons to continue.

Hiya again guys,
I'm in a big hurry to get out the door but wanted to reply to this portion right now as it caught my eye, will look at more later!
My fiance and I both take very active roles in character creation, and in general we have twisted the explorers concepts and/or just said straight out that it didn't work (he doesn't like that lol). As far as how interactive our character building sessions are:
We have everyone sit down at the table and decide what party roles each player wants to fill and what their basic concept of their character is, then fill out basic portions of their character sheet, we then both require that players produce a minimum of a 1 page character history to give us ideas of how the characters work internally and externally and finally before the game actually starts we go and do private intros with every character prior to them meeting the rest of the group in character.
Sadly, many of our players don't always provide a written character history but for those who do, we give an exp bonus to. (this has helped some ppl do it more often.)
With the explorer, he never turns in a written history although we still walk him through every other step of the intro before we start the true campaign. Ack, in a hurry, gotta run!

White Rose

 

[W.Rose]

White Rose (Love the name & Avatar!);

If that fails, have the next NPC that he assaults be a high-level Wizard or Witch, and cast Curse upon him, making him permanently silenced (and unable to argue, or even complain about it) for as long as it takes him to get someone to cast Remove Curse upon him...

Lol, Thanks for the compliment Steverooo on name!
I love your ideas on some ways to see just how the explorer would respond to such challenges! It is definitely a route neither my fiancee nor I have tried in the past.
Thank you!!!

White Rose

 

[Templetroll]

I guess you could always get a new group.

In any event, have you considered the option of letting one of the others try their hand at running a game? It could work out really well (dynamic and exciting) or it could turn into a huge mess (distracted, silly).

I think offering the chance to run a game to the player who is monopolizing game time is a great idea. It will give them some insight into what it takes to be the DM and have to handle problems like they cause as players. It might be what they actually like to do, having the control of the game, but hopefully without trying to control too much.

 

[W.Rose]

3) Make horrible things happen to the "explorer" when he pushes the line. You need to be careful with this one, as you don't want to quell the characters abilities to be free thinking, and explorative, but, you need to keep control of the game.
...
5) Don't blame one, for the sheep like reactions of the bunch. A leader, good or bad, leads. If the other characters are following the "explorer" into certain death, then death it is.

Thats all I can think for now (actually, I'm just tired of typing), so I look forward to your replies.

Devilbat,
You've brought up some very true facts and I can definitely agree with many of the statements you've made.
I think in many ways, we also just need players in our group to speak up on the spot rather than talking to us away from him. Communication is, after all a MAJOR key in any D&D group/game if it is to be successful.

White Rose

 

[_insert name here_]

I think offering the chance to run a game to the player who is monopolizing game time is a great idea. It will give them some insight into what it takes to be the DM and have to handle problems like they cause as players. It might be what they actually like to do, having the control of the game, but hopefully without trying to control too much.

I know that looks like a good idea, because we've tried it

Sadly enough, the game ended up being more about his NPCs than the PCs. I was willing to give the campaign time to develop, but then again I'll put up with a heck of a lot more than a lot of people. Others in our group actually wanted to leave while this campaign was going on, which we just couldn't let happen

As I said, our normal DMs have spoiled us

Oh, and to address the dominant player comment earlier, he is a strong force on the table, but whichever DM isn't DMing tends to be a bit more dominant than he is. I've been the party leader in this group with that happening in the past, and it made for some interesting times. Nothing like the stress of cranking up the personal presence when you're used to hanging back

 

[Bansidhe]

Thanks for all the advise. We are taking into account, and hope that things will get better for everyone concerned. Happy gaming all.
Bansidhe

 

[fusangite]

Now, I come to the two players that we are having problems with. Both of these players are the oldest members of our group, outdistancing the rest of us by at least 10 years. The first guy is here for the fun of it. I have no problem with that. However, he makes characters that amuse him with no regards to campaign integrity.

Can you give us some examples of the character-campaign mismatches here? Your description could fit one of about five situations so more details/examples would help.

Between game sessions he is one of the two people who writes things for the game (character journals and such) and he is able to talk about the fact that his character has strong feelings towards another character when not at the table.

This seems inconsisent with what you've said above so details would definitely be useful. If he's sufficiently invested in his character to be like this, it sounds like his play isn't frivolous by any stretch.

Our last player is an awesome roleplayer, and he is convinced of that. Though his talent at offering differing opinions in the same scene (when dealing with 2 characters) and to keep them in his mind well is a testament to his abilities, sadly when he plays he generally has 2 archetypes that he plays with.

As others have said. A rules change will clear this right up.

The problem player didn't agree and so tried it. The creatures that had been growling jumped him and were far too powerful for these two to fight (the one who wanted to stay on the stairs was unwilling to just wait and watch his companion be torn apart by bears). The next week, his new character lead the party into a death trap that they had just escaped from (I have no idea why they followed him back into it, but they did). He blamed (at the time) both decisions on the fact that he hadn't gotten sleep the night before. Later, he said that part of his decision the second time was just that he was angry that his character had died the week before.

I have and occasionally am a player like this. And I have a suggestion here. My feeling is that this guy can only be totally domineering "in character;" only his character can deliver 15-minute monologues shouting the whole time and then essentially make the other players do whatever he wants for fear of being subjected to another one. So, I recommend this: having the party make decisions about what course of action to take out of character. If he's participating in the discussion as himself rather than his character, in all likelihood it will be a more egalitarian discussion.

He is prone to making characters that NEED a follower and as soon as he gets his follower no one else is likely to get anything said or done as all he will do all session is sit there arguing between his two characters on opposing sides of view (and these views don't have to make sense for him to do it).

You can see how getting decisions to be made out of character can clean this right up.

Not letting him have a follower is easy enough, but then he just starts picking fights with other players like "Mage, you are not throwing those fireballs big enough, you just don't impress me why should I do anything for you?" (yes, he has done this to members of our group).

It seems to me that this is best addressed socially rather than mechanically. A simple "I kind of want to see what happens next might send things in the right direction." Have people tried this? What has been his reaction?

His characters also have a tendancy to be destined for some greatness, he has proposed character histories before that are "I am an avatar of X god hidden in the body of a paladin." or "I am an intergalactic explorer come to this backwards world to help these ppl, my monk appearance is just a 'guise." and there are many many many more over the past few years.

Now both my fiance and I are willing to accept these character concepts once in a while but in EVERY game, he has to have this same style of concept and unwilling to play anything more of the norm

What do you mean? His concepts sound silly and intensely lame. What happens when these character concepts are turned down? How does he react? What is meant by "unwilling to play anything else"? Does he ever threaten to quit the game if he can't? If not, how does he express this unwillingness?

Just curious -- this guy have any particular insecurities he's compensating for? Surely seems like it from this end...

Well, the part of your post I don't quote I don't quote because I agree with it 100%. The dinner guest comparison should be used more often to detect what kind of problem is going on in a game. However, what good could come of knowing what real world issue this guy's psychological problem is attached to? Besides, it may be that this condition is uncaused. Some people are just like that.

Anyway, I suspect that problem player #2 may simply be too socially dysfunctional to be part of your group. And so I have the feeling our various recommendations will fail. However, I am curious about what he is like at a dinner party or other non-gaming gathering for this reason.

 

[The Thayan Menace]

Give 'Em the Boot (Pop Quiz)

Okay, it's time for a simple quiz.

Do either of these players:

1. Annoy you and/or others at the table?
2. Waste the group's time?
3. Make gaming into a chore?
4. Generate threads on ENworld?

If you answered "yes" to all of these questions, then you should simply boot the offending player(s).

As the infamous Dagger once told me ...

"Life is short. The time to game is even shorter! You know what to do ...."