D&D 3E/3.5 Problems with 3.5 I don't wanna see in 4th

[Ninja-to]

Here's my list of 'don't do's' and wishes for 4E. These problems were a major headache and in some cases broken enough to ruin encounters. I know at least a few have been mentioned before, but for lack of a Search button, here they are again in a new thread, with others.


1. Darkness spells casting 'shadowy illumination'. Please make it 'dark'...!
2. Invisibility. Where to begin. Either start giving saves for this spell, or create much more readily available methods of overcoming it. This has always been a problematic game mechanic.
3. Ethereal/Incorporeal/Gaseous/'Touch' attacks. My god... do I need to even mention the issues with these? Please simplify it. 2nd ed was 'need +1 weapons to hit' and it was on with the show. The very name of 'touch attack'... sigh.
4. Our 3.5 Silence is broken. I hope we get a new one.
5. Evards Black Tentacles is also on the fritz. With the new grapple rules, this will of course get a tune up.
6. Rope Trick/Non-Dimensional spaces/Bags of holding/Portable holes. Please explain in more detail. Make it clear if it's bad, then what happens after combining these effects. Oh and also, Rope Trick is broken. At the least, it's like a 'save our game so we can rest again in the middle of the dungeon' button.
7. Fly. Need more mundane methods of taking down someone who's flying. Arrows and javelins are 'nice', but there needs to be a greater limit on who can fly and for how long IMO.
8. Related to the below comment, Undead and Demons... please, if you do only one of the changes I've asked for, please, please, PLEEEEEASE make it that UNDEAD and DEMONS/DEVILS can see in natural darkness to any range...!! For both a mechanical and common sense point of view, I hate to have Pit Fiends and Liches ordering minions to carry torches around or light a corridor because they can't see further than 60 feet in the dark. Sigh.
**9. Detect Evil. Again... please, do something about this. As a DM, this would always make your Chaotic Evil sweet-talker dooomed to dangle on the end of a Paladin's spiked chain.

**UPDATE: After viewing the new 4E Pit Fiend monster entry, I noticed that Pit Fiends still have 'Darkvision', yet, there is hope. The Darkvision entry no longer has a measly 60 foot range, though who knows what the range actually is. For the love of all that is unholy, please, please make sure that this new Darkvision doesn't have a range of 60 feet! Omfg.

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

3. Ethereal/Incorporeal/Gaseous/'Touch' attacks. My god... do I need to even mention the issues with these? Please simplify it. 2nd ed was 'need +1 weapons to hit' and it was on with the show. The very name of 'touch attack'... sigh.

Touch attacks are definitely out. Now they're attacks vs. Reflex defense (along with ranged touch attacks and anything that used to require a Reflex save). Plus, the ethereal plane is gone from the core cosmology, so presumably no more jaunting that way.

7. Fly. Need more mundane methods of taking down someone who's flying. Arrows and javelins are 'nice', but there needs to be a greater limit on who can fly and for how long IMO.

Flying SEEMS (based on a few of the 4e magic items mentioned) to start at the Paragon tier, so no more wizards floating at level 5, I'm guessing.

 

[Ninja-to]

Yeah just reading through the updated notes on 4E and you're right, touch attacks and flat footed ac are out.

Flying is still pretty complicated enough that I haven't bothered to learn the rules in the 8 years of 3rd ed.

Just about the only rule I care to remember is that if you don't have perfect maneuverability you don't get to hover...

 

[Ninja-to]

How do you delete posts...?

 

[helium3]

As far as I know, you ask the mods to delete the thread.

 

[arscott]

8. Related to the below comment, Undead and Demons... please, if you do only one of the changes I've asked for, please, please, PLEEEEEASE make it that UNDEAD and DEMONS/DEVILS can see in natural darkness to any range...!! For both a mechanical and common sense point of view, I hate to have Pit Fiends and Liches ordering minions to carry torches around or light a corridor because they can't see further than 60 feet in the dark. Sigh.

I can't speak for 4e, but SW Saga Edition really simplifies the vision abilities:
Low-light Vision: You can ignore concealment (but not total concealment) from darkness.
Darkvision: You can ignore concealment and total concealment from darkness.

No range or nothing. Just "you can still see in the dark".

**9. Detect Evil. Again... please, do something about this. As a DM, this would always make your Chaotic Evil sweet-talker dooomed to dangle on the end of a Paladin's spiked chain.

From what we've heard, fewer characters in 4e actually have alignment. Only the most noble creatures are considered good, and only the most vile are considered evil.

Look at the recently released statcards for the new edition of the D&D minis game:

There's only one Good-Aligned creature--The Angel of Vengance. Such champions of good as Bruenor Battlehammer and the Human Cleric of Bahamut are considered neutral. Likewise, the set has only four evil creatures: A demon, two devils, and the Blood of Vol Fanatic. Drow Spider Priestess? Not Evil. Ravenous Ghoul? Not evil. Nightmare? Not evil. Unless your sweet-talker sacrifices babies to Orcus every night, I don't think you have much to worry about.

 

[Ninja-to]

I can't speak for 4e, but SW Saga Edition really simplifies the vision abilities:
Low-light Vision: You can ignore concealment (but not total concealment) from darkness.
Darkvision: You can ignore concealment and total concealment from darkness.

No range or nothing. Just "you can still see in the dark".

From what we've heard, fewer characters in 4e actually have alignment. Only the most noble creatures are considered good, and only the most vile are considered evil.

Look at the recently released statcards for the new edition of the D&D minis game:

There's only one Good-Aligned creature--The Angel of Vengance. Such champions of good as Bruenor Battlehammer and the Human Cleric of Bahamut are considered neutral. Likewise, the set has only four evil creatures: A demon, two devils, and the Blood of Vol Fanatic. Drow Spider Priestess? Not Evil. Ravenous Ghoul? Not evil. Nightmare? Not evil. Unless your sweet-talker sacrifices babies to Orcus every night, I don't think you have much to worry about.

Really hope you're right.

 

[Sitara]

All detect alignment type spells and abilities are gone. Permanently.

Desingers said they wanted roleplaying to find someones alignment, not via a spell. Though I hope paladins get something else to make up for this...say a detect lies or detect gastronimical indigestion or something.

 

[Doug McCrae]

Agree with a lot of the issues you raised. Invisibility in particular is much too powerful to be a second level spell. Tsk, Gary, what were you thinking?

 

[Sitara]

It still pales in comparison to rope trick, sleep, mirror image. (especially when you consider all these spells can be cast while the mage is invisi)