D&D 5E Proposal: Petition for PoL to be released to SRD

If anything PoL is a little more S&S in feel than more typical D&D settings, which are very high-fantasy, or at least, very high-magic.

I'm not sure I agree. Generic D&D is greyhawk by my book - no tieflings, no dragonborn...

But the general vibe of PoL really suits the 4e ruleset, with some niceties (eg: no easy teleport).

Anyway I would love to see a conversion of the Iron Circle adventure to 5e - and maybe even see it expanded into an hardbound adventure.
 

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Wanting to play in the 4e setting is a reasonable request.

But it seems to me, virtually everything can already be done using the 5e default Forgotten Realms setting.

To implement the ‘points of light’ philosophy, where most of the setting is undefined, just pick a region in one of the remote continents of FR Toril that are not Faerun.

5e already has most of the 4e races. Tiefling and Dragonborn are Players Handbook canon. For the Warforged, I doubt anyone would say anything if you rename them ‘War Golem’, constructed out of wood and metal, or even describe them as hollow suits of armor. Then just use the Warforged stats from the Unearthed Arcana options.

5e already has the 4e cosmology, the World Axis.

Nature = Material Plane
Feywild = Feywild
Shadowfell = Shadowfell
Astral Sea = Astral Plane
Domains = Outer Planes plus demiplane Domains
Elemental Chaos = Elemental Plane where elemental regions intermingle at each others borders.

Plus 5e FR adds an extra Ether realm. No problem.

If there are aspects of FR that are unwanted, dont use them, and make products that dont mention them.

But there are specific defined parts of the PoL setting that it would be nice to be able to reference. The Nentir Vale was a specific area that was fleshed out fairly well and I think some would like to continue to expand upon it. Or set adventures or explore characters and locations during the height of Nerath, or Arkoshia, or Bael Turath. That is what some want and your suggestions don't allow access to the Nentir Vale or its history in the Forgotten Realms as far as I can tell.

Personally, I really liked the dawn war and the primordials. Though there is reference to the Dawn War, there is no reference to the Primorodials (except as a language for elementals) themselves that I have found. I could possibly make new ones, but using the ones that existed in 4e would not be allowed (I think). That, to me, is unfortunate.
 

4e had an excellent cosmology. It was resonant with reallife archetypes, and well thought out for use in a game.

Personally, I really liked the dawn war and the primordials. Though there is reference to the Dawn War, there is no reference to the Primorodials (except as a language for elementals) themselves that I have found. I could possibly make new ones, but using the ones that existed in 4e would not be allowed (I think). That, to me, is unfortunate.

If Forgotten Realms via the Players Handbook, mentions the ‘Primordial’ language. Then Primordials are canon. Use the term in the sense of the most ancient Elementals, the language that they spoke, and those alive today who preserve their traditions, including the language.

Similarly, ‘Anglo’ can be used as a term to mean anyone who speaks English, whether in Mumbai or Miami. ‘Franco’ can mean anyone who speaks French whether in Montreal or Paris. And so on.

Compare the Celestial as a name. Altho Celestial refers to the language, Celestials also means those who are native to the Good Outer Planes. Infernals the Lawful Evil ones, especially Devils. And so on.

Similarly, Primordials are canon, and you can refer to them as such. (Maybe even say, Primordial is the language of the Neutral alignment, especially as Elementals exemplify it.)



But there are specific defined parts of the PoL setting that it would be nice to be able to reference. The Nentir Vale was a specific area that was fleshed out fairly well and I think some would like to continue to expand upon it. Or set adventures or explore characters and locations during the height of Nerath, or Arkoshia, or Bael Turath. That is what some want and your suggestions don't allow access to the Nentir Vale or its history in the Forgotten Realms as far as I can tell.

The Forgotten Realms is a setting that has archeological perspective, with a timeline that covers tens of thousands of years. Moreover, Dragonborn and Tiefling are canonical races in FR. They have histories. Likely that had notable histories on one of the other continents. There can be entire empires on these other continents existing simultaneously with the kingdoms on Faerun, but with minimal contact with each other.

Track down the FR information about Dragonborn and Tiefling that is canon. It seems not much info about them. Try to incorporate this info as ‘facts’ in your setting. Then use 4e for inspiration for the histories that happen before, after, and around.

For example, in the 5e PH, it specifically says that Tiefling ‘lack a homeland’. Tiefling can show up anywhere as a Half Devil or a Half Demon. But there is plenty of room for a civilization that made some kind of Warlock pact for power during a war, which transformed an entire kingdom, and ultimately brought about its selfdestruction. This is similar to the history of the Drow. Except where the Drow went into exile underground and then transformed. The Tiefling transformed and then were scattered.

According to FR canon, the Dragonborn seem to be a ‘designer race’ resulting from magical alteration, ‘hatched from dragon eggs as a unique race’. Seems to me, Dragons did this for their own Draconic purposes. It is likely Dragonborn had their own civilization on one of the other continents. Create their FR histories, while drawing inspiration from 4e canon.

Personally, I would make up new names for these other civilizations. But if it is important that other players recognize the connection, use a lampshade name. Something like Ariksha and Baltur. Then, when the 4e setting becomes available, you can update your product to say something like, ‘in some dialects, Ariksha is known by its more ancient cognate Arkoshia.’
 
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I'm not sure I agree. Generic D&D is greyhawk by my book - no tieflings, no dragonborn...
Greyhawk is copyrighted/trademarkable IP, so hardly generic. 'Iconic' might be a better way of expressing what you're getting at. Greyhawk and Blackmoor were the first D&D settings, and much more was published for the former than the latter, so it's iconic.

But my point wasn't generic so much as genre. Greyhawk, FR, Ebberon, Planescape and D&D in general, mechanically, skew towards the very high-magic end of the genre spectrum, and, thanks to 'Vancian' magic, deviate rather profoundly in the details of that magic, as well. It's been said that D&D has defined its own self-referent genre.

But the general vibe of PoL really suits the 4e ruleset, with some niceties (eg: no easy teleport).
PoL, with its idea that the forces of good/civilization (even evilish civilizations) aren't broadly ascendant means none of the magocracies and theocracies implied by the primacy of magic. In that sense, it dovetails with 4e's less magic-dominated system, but mostly the 4e system doesn't imply as much about the setting as other editions, since all those PC class rules aren't generally used for NPCs, could even easily apply only to the PCs, alone, so there's less of an implication about what sorts of characters wield the greatest power or how the setting otherwise 'must' be as a result of applying the rules to everyone/thing in the setting.


But there are specific defined parts of the PoL setting that it would be nice to be able to reference. The Nentir Vale was a specific area that was fleshed out fairly well and I think some would like to continue to expand upon it.
Though it was really nothing more than an example. You could drop the Nentir Vale on the Sword Coast somewhere and it wouldn't change that much, except for going from a 'point of light' in an otherwise hostile world, to a backwater in an otherwise cosmopolitan one.
Or set adventures or explore characters and locations during the height of Nerath, or Arkoshia, or Bael Turath.
Personally, I really liked the dawn war and the primordials.
4e had an excellent cosmology. It was resonant with reallife archetypes, and well thought out for use in a game.
...Personally, I would make up new names for these other civilizations. But if it is important that other players recognize the connection, use a lampshade name. Something like Ariksha and Baltur. Then, when the 4e setting becomes available, you can update your product to say something like, ‘in some dialects, Ariksha is known by its more ancient cognate Arkoshia.’
The vague histories of Arkhozia and Ba'al Taureth and the Primeval Conflict are, indeed, the kind of things you could just hash new proper nouns for and move on. They're examples of archetypes, a Golden Age, a Decadent Period, and a creation myth of any sort could provide similar set dressing for a campaign.

It's just nice to have some proper nouns in common and familiar throughout the community.
 

Though it was really nothing more than an example. You could drop the Nentir Vale on the Sword Coast somewhere and it wouldn't change that much, except for going from a 'point of light' in an otherwise hostile world, to a backwater in an otherwise cosmopolitan one. The vague histories of Arkhozia and Ba'al Taureth and the Primeval Conflict are, indeed, the kind of things you could just hash new proper nouns for and move on. They're examples of archetypes, a Golden Age, a Decadent Period, and a creation myth of any sort could provide similar set dressing for a campaign.

It's just nice to have some proper nouns in common and familiar throughout the community.

If you spent 4 years adventuring in those proper nouns they can feel important, that's what you want. Also, just dropping it into the Sword Coast wouldn't work. There is a history to the Vale that isn't consistent with the history of the Coast.
 

Sign me up. But I think any petition should be aimed at opening up the Guild to ANY non Forgotten Realms stuff ASAP. I love POL and would love to see it fleshed out but it but one setting which needs 5e support. I can see they want to see if the guild idea works with a narrower set of material, but seriously FR is the most overexposed and over explained setting already.
 

Sign me up. But I think any petition should be aimed at opening up the Guild to ANY non Forgotten Realms stuff ASAP. I love POL and would love to see it fleshed out but it but one setting which needs 5e support. I can see they want to see if the guild idea works with a narrower set of material, but seriously FR is the most overexposed and over explained setting already.
They have already made strong hints (I don't want to say promises) they will open up the DMG to more campaign settings.

You'll just have to wait. Ravenloft is probably next in line.
 

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