Question about Feats triggered by fighting defensively

[Kol]

There are several feats and abilities that are usable when fighting defensively (Specifically in this case: Elaborate Parry from the Duelist PrC and Melee Evasion feat from PHBII). Can these abilities be used while using Combat Expertise instead of fighting defensively?

Melee Evasion says it can be used "while fighting defensively".

Elaborate Parry says it can be used "if the duelist chooses to fight defensively or use total defense in melee".

I think that they would be usable while using Combat Expertise because the Normal clause of Combat Expertise states that "A character without Combat Expertise can fight defensively" so I interpret Combat Expertise to be an improved version of fighting defensively.

What do other people think?

 

[Hypersmurf]

I think that they would be usable while using Combat Expertise because the Normal clause of Combat Expertise states that "A character without Combat Expertise can fight defensively" so I interpret Combat Expertise to be an improved version of fighting defensively.

It's not - that note in the feat is to say "If you don't have this feat, you're not completely incapable of improving your AC". But the fact that you can use Combat Expertise and Fight Defensively at the same time, with the bonuses stacking, tells us that Combat Expertise doesn't replace Fighting Defensively.

If a feat doesn't say it can be triggered by using Combat Expertise, it can't; you must Fight Defensively in order to do so, if that's what the feat says.

-Hyp.

 

[Kol]

But the fact that you can use Combat Expertise and Fight Defensively at the same time, with the bonuses stacking, tells us that Combat Expertise doesn't replace Fighting Defensively.

How odd... We've always played that they don't stack...

Oh, I see... that clause isn't in the description of Fight Defensively as a Full-Attack option (PHB 143) but it is in the description of Fight Defensively as a Standard action (PHB 140). That'll learn me...

Seems a little strange that they stack, but many rules seem a little strange to me. Ah well... -4 to hit is still worth it for the benefit in this particular character's case.

Thanks, Hyp.