D&D 5E Question from a newbie about cantrips

[Calendyr]

We decided to start a D&D 5th edition campaign and there is 1 rule I am not sure how to apply.

Situation: Level 1 fighter, Soldier background, High Elf (Moon Elf) with an Int of 11.

As moon elf, the character gets 1 free cantrip. The one chosen was Fire Bolt.

Question: With an INT of 11, the bonus would be 0. Do any other type of bonus apply to the to hit? Is this considered a proficiency and does it get a +2 for level 1?

 

[Voadam]

Player's Handbook page 194 under attack rolls:

"Proficiency Bonus. You add your proficiency bonus to your attack roll when you attack using a weapon with which you have proficiency, as well as when you attack with a spell."

Characters either have proficiency with a weapon or they do not so they may or may not get proficiency bonus when attacking with a specific weapon. There is no proficiency with spells that some characters get similar to weapons. All characters gain proficiency bonus with all spell attacks.

 

[aco175]

Would the above fighter improve damage at 5th level to 2d10 or would he need to become a caster 5th level?

 

[ECMO3]

Would the above fighter improve damage at 5th level to 2d10 or would he need to become a caster 5th level?

Damage improves to 2d10 at 5th level in any class. 5th level fighter, 5th level caster, multiclassed 3rd level fighter/2nd level Rogue.

It does not matter the damage improves to 2d10.

 

[Stormonu]

Damage improves to 2d10 at 5th level in any class. 5th level fighter, 5th level caster, multiclassed 3rd level fighter/2nd level Rogue.

It does not matter the damage improves to 2d10.

Personal opinion, but I wouldn't allow that. Just as a fighter 3/rogue 2 doesn't get the fighter's extra attack, I wouldn't give the damage increase.

 

[Voadam]

Personal opinion, but I wouldn't allow that. Just as a fighter 3/rogue 2 doesn't get the fighter's extra attack, I wouldn't give the damage increase.

The comparison is not to what a fighter 3/Rogue 2 does with their weapon attack, it is what anyone who gets the cantrip does with the cantrip at 5th level RAW from the spell description.

FIRE BOLT
Evocation cantrip
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: 120 feet
Components: V, S
Duration: Instantaneous
You hurl a mote of fire at a creature or object within range. Make a ranged spell attack against the target. On a hit, the target takes 1d10 fire damage. A flammable object hit by this spell ignites if it isn't being worn or carried.
This spell's damage increases by 1d10 when you reach 5th level (2d10), 11th level (3d10), and 17th level (4d10).

Restricting it to 1d10 unless the character has enough levels of wizard would be kind of an odd nerf to the Fighter 3/Rogue 2 who specifically took the magic initiate feat to get this wizard cantrip, which seems the only way for a PH F3/R2 to cast it. And that build with that feat seems a decent way to style themself like The Witcher from the show (lightly armored, tough and great at fighting with a big sword, one ranged attack spell in combat, not really any of the ranger stuff).

 

[Umbran]

Personal opinion, but I wouldn't allow that. Just as a fighter 3/rogue 2 doesn't get the fighter's extra attack, I wouldn't give the damage increase.

Why not? The damage increase is clearly not unbalanced for a character of that overall level.

 

[Stormonu]

Why not? The damage increase is clearly not unbalanced for a character of that overall level.

Almost everything else is tied to class level. If weapon damage increased by character level similarly, I'd use the character level for cantrips. To me to use character level for cantrips shafts the martials in yet another way.

 

[aco175]

I can see it as well. A fire bolt dealing 2d10 at 5th level beats people at my table shooting a bow for 1d8+3. The benefit of range never comes up. Also my table never uses the big 3-4 feats, so this damage does appear to outpace most. Maybe if the rogue was using sneak attack or if the fighter hits with both attacks- only if he did not multi-class.

 

[Voadam]

Almost everything else is tied to class level.

Or proficiency bonus.

If weapon damage increased by character level similarly, I'd use the character level for cantrips. To me to use character level for cantrips shafts the martials in yet another way.

So to address the caster-martial imbalance in multiclassing you discourage casters from diluting their casting power through multiclassing and you discourage martials from dipping into magical classes?

I expect this would structurally incentivize more single classed casters.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Almost everything else is tied to class level. If weapon damage increased by character level similarly, I'd use the character level for cantrips. To me to use character level for cantrips shafts the martials in yet another way.

Except that the fighter by that level would be doing more damage with martial attacks, whether from class bonuses or gear. A damage cantrip is supposed to be the equivalent of a light crossbow, so that wizards and sorcerers don't have the weird indignity of lugging around a ranged weapon to use when they run out of spells..

The player, by choosing a moon elf, gave up part of their budget to have that instead of something more martial. Even if it levels up, it won't be as damaging as that same fighter actually using a crossbow with all their associated class abilities. Given that this is a fighter, they probably won't be using the cantrip very often after the first few levels, when their martial abilities outpace it.

Making the cantrip -- which is on the character sheet by player choice -- suck more doesn't do anything to change how game balance works and just makes the player unhappy with their choice to satisfy someone not sitting at the table with them.