D&D 4E Quick rules question about Pulling in 4E

[Amaroq]

Errr ... I can't see how changing your personal facing in any way changes the definition of "horizontal", which literally means "parallel to the horizon", and seems pretty clearly expressed as "in the plane which lies perpendicular to the vector of gravity."

 

[Jack99]

Thread title fail! I had this horrible image of people taking the 4e = WoW image WAY to far.

I would say this is much more a thread reading fail. I played wow for 2 years and did not make that reference.

All mobs in WoW are not tethered and thus pulling is very simplistic and virtually unknown. Real pulling was in Everquest where skill and timing of your monk meant the difference between a success raid and a wipe.

 

[MarkB]

By the rules, forced movement is limited to horizontal movement precisely to avoid the "I push/slide the enemy 5 squares straight up and let him fall" scenario.

However, it is common (sufficiently so that it made it into at least one LFR adventure) to house-rule that a creature can be forced to move vertically if it has a currently-active movement mode that allows such movement (i.e. flight, or swimming if underwater). This avoids annoyances like having flying enemies being immune to your efforts to pull them down to ground level.

 

[Colmarr]

All mobs in WoW are not tethered and thus pulling is very simplistic and virtually unknown.

Pulling unknown?

My experience was vastly different. Virtually every combat began with a pull, to give the group room to move and to minimise the chance of additional enemies joining in.

And I can remember at least one combat that was vastly different based on which enemy you pulled (the mobs before Mekgineer Thermaplugg in Gnomeregan).

There was definitely pulling, unless you meant your post in a "That's not pulling. This is pulling" way.

 

[DracoSuave]

My general understanding is that if forced movement would cause harm in the form of damage to a character, then they are entitled to a save..

Only if that is the result of terrain.

Power and effects of powers and abilities do NOT count as terrain (unless they say so.) This fall, on the other hand, does.

 

[Jack99]

Pulling unknown?

My experience was vastly different. Virtually every combat began with a pull, to give the group room to move and to minimise the chance of additional enemies joining in.

And I can remember at least one combat that was vastly different based on which enemy you pulled (the mobs before Mekgineer Thermaplugg in Gnomeregan).

There was definitely pulling, unless you meant your post in a "That's not pulling. This is pulling" way.

I should have been more specific. While yes, you pull in WoW (as in you tag the monsters so that they come at you) there was no skill involved, at all. In 99% of all cases of pulls, you could only get X creatures, no matter how little skill you had. There were a few exceptions, granted, usually involving some wanderers, but that was about it. So, while you are right that there is some pulling involved, I am loathe to call it that based on the low amount of skill it takes. I am talking about raids, btw, not 5-mans.

 

[Pickles JG]

By the rules, forced movement is limited to horizontal movement precisely to avoid the "I push/slide the enemy 5 squares straight up and let him fall" scenario.

I thought it was you could only be forced moved into a square that you could move into yourself. So not through enemies or upwards.

Any monster or power could specifically overturn this rule, exception based design &c - as the "houseruled" LFR rafter grabbers do.

 

[DracoSuave]

Oh, yeah, the other thing.

If your power says 'Pull X squares to a square adjacent to you' then you could not pull the target over the cliff because they cannot legally walk there.

And that's the terminology. 'Walk' and not any other movement action.

But, if they are flying, you can pull them vertically because the walk action allows them to move there.

 

[MarkB]

I thought it was you could only be forced moved into a square that you could move into yourself. So not through enemies or upwards.

Any monster or power could specifically overturn this rule, exception based design &c - as the "houseruled" LFR rafter grabbers do.

I was sure there was a separate rule, introduced as errata or FAQ, that specifically precluded vertical forced movement. But after a reasonably thorough search, I'm coming up empty on any such thing. I guess I must've misinterpreted some previous discussion on the subject.

 

[DracoSuave]

I was sure there was a separate rule, introduced as errata or FAQ, that specifically precluded vertical forced movement. But after a reasonably thorough search, I'm coming up empty on any such thing. I guess I must've misinterpreted some previous discussion on the subject.

Specifically, forced movement does not allow you to go into any square you cannot 'walk' into. That means any movement legal by a walk action.

Can you normally walk vertically? No. Therefore you cannot be forcemoved vertically. However, if you have a fly speed, that changes, as all normal movement is through the walk action.