Rage and Sneak Attack?

[Sal]

Hi, I'm playing a Brb/Rog. My Dm ruled that he can't sneak attack while raging, because sneak attack requires precision and rage is reckless. I can see where he is coming from, but what are the RAW? Just wondering.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks from Sal.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

The RAW is that you can Rage and sneak attack. Rage prevents you from doing anything that requires concentration (like spellcasting or maintaining certain bardic music). The obvious area of things disallowed is spellcasting. The ban also extends to any skill or ability that would require a concentration check to avoid getting disrupted.

Note that even if you were to extend the definition to include ANYTHING that can be disrupted by an enemy's attack/AoO, which would actually prohibit you from using Grapple and Sunder (which seems a little extreme to me, but hey, just using as an example) without the Improved feats...sneak attack is still RAW legal. Nowhere in any book is there ever any indication of sneak attack being able to be disrupted. It doesn't matter if you're struck by an AoO in between, it doesn't matter if you're in stormy weather on a boat. You get sneak attack. It requires no real concentration, it's simply limited by the conditions that don't allow for sneak attack -- vitals out of reach, concealment of any kind, immunity to crits -- which is already pretty restrictive.

 

[ValhallaGH]

My Dm ruled that he can't sneak attack while raging, because sneak attack requires precision and rage is reckless.

Relevant rules as written (RAW):
1) The DM's rulings are always right. (Though you may be able to debate them, but not mid-session because that's tacky.)
2) You can sneak attack any time you meet the conditions of sneak attack (flanking, flat-footed target, can properly perceive the target, etc.) and the target is not immune to sneak attack.
3) Not RAW, but there's a lot of very squishy organs and major blood vessels in the way of the raging barbarian's ax. If the target is distracted enough to allow sneak attack from the rogue's greatclub, why can't the barbarian's great ax get it?

If the DM stands by his ruling then the best options are a) shut up and enjoy the rest of the game (possibly trying to re-build your character since it's not as good as you'd planned for), or b) quit and fine another game.

Good luck.

 

[Sal]

Ok, I just called my friend and told him what the 2 of you said and he will talk about it with his son who is the DM. I got another question. My character has Knowledge devotion from CC and Education from ECS. Am I able to get the insight bonus to hit and damage while raging? BTW my other feats are Power Attack and Reckless Rage from RoS.

Thanks again.

Sincerely from Sal.

 

[Dandu]

RAW yes.

 

[frankthedm]

I can see where he is coming from, but what are the RAW? Just wondering.

The host of my game group makes the same ruling when he runs d20. Seems reasonable to me as well, but it is not something to surprise someone with after a character is built.

Personally I prefer banning sneak attacking with 2 handed weapons.

 

[Dandu]

Really? What's the logic in that?

I mean, if you can sneak attack with two weapons in each hand...

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

The next time you're playing your raging barbarian/rogue and can sneak attack, stand up on the gaming table and loudly declare, "GRAHHH! I'm so ing pissed off! I'm stabbing that little bastard RIGHT IN THE ING EYE!!!!!. I want eye puss on my blade, and then I'm gonna lick it RIGHT OFF, who cares if I cut my tongue a little, that's what damage reduction's for!"

Maybe he'll give you bonus xp for LARPing.

 

[Dandu]

If your DM is worried about your raging sneak attacker being overpowered, you may want to consider rolling up a druid...

 

[ValhallaGH]

If your DM is worried about your raging sneak attacker being overpowered, you may want to consider rolling up a druid...

Just so he knows what overpowered really looks like? ... That's not the best way to make or maintain a friendship, though it can be an excellent way to make a point.