Ranged Disarm

[Anubis]

I'm not sure how often the designers ever looked at how disarming opponents worked, but I can't figure out for the life of me why you can only attempt it with a melee action. Let's look at this realistically. Ranged attacks have been used for thousands of years to disarm opponents. Shoot the hand, whatever. It happens, and it's not something you need special training to do really.

I propose that disarm should be used with any type of attack, including any ranged attacks. I can't think of any reason not to. Thoughts?

 

[Enamel_32]

There is a feat on one of the combat-related books on ranged pinning (to a wall) as well as one on disarming. My guess it that it's in the complete warrior.

 

[Nyaricus]

it is in Complete Warrior, page 103.

RANGED DISARM
you can disarm a foe from a distance
Prereqs - Dex 15, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, BAB +5
Benefit - Choose one type of ranged weapon with which you are proficient. You can amke a disarm attempt with this weapon as long as your target is within 30ft.
Special - A fighter may select Ranged Disarm as one of his fighter bonus feats.

Summary: this feat is kinda dumb. Improved crit, weapon spec (etc) gives you benefits with only one weapon but weapon focus is a prereq. This feat breaks that rule. Solution: this feat lets you make ranged disarms with all ranged weapons in which you are prof in. with weapons you are not prof in, this feat gives you no effect.

hows that do for you?

 

[Nyaricus]

BTW, Enamel_32, we have the same birthday, down to the year. that's a crazy coincidence!!!

 

[Arkhandus]

Here's an example.

Fighter Fred is shooting an arrow at Barbarian Billy's (lol) greataxe. Fighter Fred strikes the greataxe with his arrow. Now do you really think that puny arrow, with its miniscule mass, is going to wrench the axe, which is several pounds heavy, out of the barbarian's grip? Consider that normally, Fighter Fred would have some difficulty even trying to knock that axe out of Barbarian Billy's grip if Fred was wielding a halberd. Comparatively speaking, that arrow's force of impact is pathetic. It may penetrate a thin layer of armor, but it doesn't carry the same knockback factor as a warhammer or something. At best the arrow will lodge in the axe's haft or, perhaps, dent the thick axehead, neither of which is likely to carry the force necessary to wrench it out of the opponent's grasp. Unless the opponent is completely unaware and not really expecting a fight (in which case, why the hell is he even holding a weapon idly, rather than leaving it sheathed?).

Now, I'm not saying it's impossible that an arrow might be able to disarm a melee weapon, but it seems rather unlikely (then again, I'm not exactly sure what the specific force of an arrow is compared to that of a halberd or something). I'd be more inclined to believe that a throwing hammer or bola might carry the necessary raw inertial power.

Likely, the feat from CW (which is based on a feat from Dragon Magazine's issue some time ago that had an article on Robin Hood) is limited to 30 feet because a ranged weapon loses some of its momentum and force after a short distance, and because it's hard to aim for the right spot on an opponent's weapon (which is comparatively much thinner than his/her body) from any significant distance.

 

[Nyeshet]

Personally, I see nothing wrong with Ranged Disarm applying to all range weapons with which you are proficient. Even then its not that powerful a feat, really. As for how it works, I've always viewed it as striking near (or even tagging) the hand holding the weapon. Also, to be honest, I would likely make it a type of opposed weapon grapple, using the size of the weapons and the strength of the wielder (arrows counting as small and not applying strength unless used with a mighty bow). Most often the arrow would have a chance of success against a dagger or finesseable light weapon, but it would rarely succeed - if ever - against a large, two handed weapon.

 

[Anubis]

Well you don't disamr someone from a range by striking the weapon; rather you strike the hand holding the weapon.

My thinking is that it shouldn't require a feat. I had searched the books and found none, but thanks for pointing that one out. I'm not sure I'm convinced a feat should be required, but I'll figure it out hopefully.

 

[ZuulMoG]

Arkhandus is right on the money here. Short of a ballista bolt, no device-propelled missile is going to strike with sufficient force to dislodge a weapon from its owners grasp, no matter how skillfully placed.

Striking their hand is a much better concept, but it opens the door to special damage effects of called shots, and why waste time aiming at a hand or wrist when the eye/face/throat is right there begging for a clothyard shaft? Basically you want to make a Called Shot Critical Strike, and that's mayhem waiting to happen. 'Realistically', such a thing should be possible, but in deference to game balance, it is not.

 

[Varianor Abroad]

"You got your reality in my rules!"

"You got your rules in my reality!"

Two great tastes that *don't* go great together.

Think about this. If you can do ranged disarms easily, then NPCs can do it to you. The CW feat is a bit stringent in its prereqs, so I wouldn't have a problem expanding it to all weapons one is proficient with.