Ranged Touch Attack -- Broken?

[Lucius Foxhound]

I was checking out Ranged Touch Attacks in the PHB the other day. And by the rules, it seems that Ranged Touch Attacks are just like regular touch attacks. By that logic, it means you can:

1) Hold a ranged touch attack charge indefinitely.
2) Reroll a missed range touch attack

Now, I realize, this makes no sense. If you cast Melf's Acid Arrow, it's an arrow that shoots out immediately from you and if it misses, the spell is lost.

But the rules say only list ranged touch attacks as a tpe of touch attack so that:

Touch attacks come in two types: melee touch attacks and ranged touch attacks. A combatant can score critical hits with either type of attack. A combatant's opponent's AC against a touch attack does not include any armor bonus, shield bonus, or natural armor bonus. The target's size modifier, Dexterity modifier, and deflection bonus (if any) all apply normally.

If youlook under "ranged attacks," it only talks about using melee weapons.

Can anyone find me where in the rules it says that you can't hold a ranged touch attack or reroll on a miss? T'anks!

 

[Femerus the Gnecro]

I believe it can be found in the PHB index under "Common Sense."



-F

 

[Henrix]

A touch spell is a spell with the range 'touch'.
Melf's Acid Arrow is a ray spell, not a touch spell.

Whether you target the spell with a touch or a ranged touch attack is a completely different matter.

 

[Dr. Zoom]

You can only hold the charge if the Target line in the spell description says "Touch." This is not the case with spells like Melf's Acid Arrow or ray spells. They simply use the "ranged touch attack" mechanic to work, but they are not "Touch" spells, per se, so you cannot "hold the charge" with them.

Edit: What Henrix said.

 

[hammymchamham]

Can anyone find me where in the rules it says that you can't hold a ranged touch attack or reroll on a miss? T'anks!

Yes, page 126 PHB says

Holding the Charge: ...you can continue to make touch atacks round after round.

Notice it specifically talks about holding touch attacks, not ranged touch attacks. Since they are not the same thing, you can't make a ranged touch attack round after round until you hit.

 

[Lucius Foxhound]

Re: Re: Ranged Touch Attack -- Broken?

Yes, page 126 PHB says... Holding the Charge: ...you can continue to make touch atacks round after round.

Notice it specifically talks about holding touch attacks, not ranged touch attacks. Since they are not the same thing, you can't make a ranged touch attack round after round until you hit.

Nope... on the page before this one, p.125, it says:

"Touch attacks come in two types: melee touch attacks (for touches made with, say, your hand) and ranged touch attacks (for touches made with magic rays, for example)."

So that's where you wrong ... it talks about holding touch attacks, not specifically melee touch attacks.

So unless it specifically says "melee touch attacks," according to the rules, a touch attack refers to either melee or ranged.

But let me just say, I agree with everyone who says it's a common sense rule ... it's just that, well, the according to the PHB, you can definitely hold the charge on a Melf's Acid Arrow.

 

[Caliban]

Re: Re: Re: Ranged Touch Attack -- Broken?

Nope... on the page before this one, p.125, it says:

"Touch attacks come in two types: melee touch attacks (for touches made with, say, your hand) and ranged touch attacks (for touches made with magic rays, for example)."

So that's where you wrong ... it talks about holding touch attacks, not specifically melee touch attacks.

So unless it specifically says "melee touch attacks," according to the rules, a touch attack refers to either melee or ranged.

But let me just say, I agree with everyone who says it's a common sense rule ... it's just that, well, the according to the PHB, you can definitely hold the charge on a Melf's Acid Arrow.

And also on page 125, it talks about spells having a range of "Touch". There is a difference between a "Touch" range spell and a spell allows a ranged touch attack.

It is confusing because they talk about both types of touch attacks on that page, but the "holding the charge" section is referring to melee touch attacks, not ranged touch attacks. Look at how it is phrased: "if you touch anything or anyone while holding a charge.." obviously refers to physically touching someone, not shooting a ray out.

 

[Henrix]

I recommend taking a look at the pages at the end of the PHB, where a lot of important definitions are given.

You'll find both 'touch attack' and 'touch spell' defined. You seem to be confusing them, but they are not the same.
And as touch spells are the only ones you can hold the charge with...

I can also recommend the current FAQ, p.43.

 

[hammymchamham]

I think then the ranged touch is discharged when you make the ranged touch. Since it refers to "if you dont discharge the spell..."

which means I can cast Melfs Acid Arrow, and then 3 rounds later discharge it when I try to attack Bob... just like if I cast Vampiric Touch and then it discharges when I touch Bob.


EDIT: After reading some other posts, and spell discriptions, Ranged spells don't have the D for dischargeing spells, where as touch spells do.

 

[Happy Monkey]

Ranged Harm is broken. It certainly isn't core rules either.