Readied action question

[D+1]

Actually, it doesn't "become your turn". If the trigger comes up, you take the action, but it is "after your turn" and it is "before your next turn".

Your initiative changes... but it changes after your readied action is completed.

The readied action is taken outside of your turn.

It doesn't "become your turn?" Let me guess. That's official Sage Speak? Rather irrelevant anyway isn't it? A pointless technicality at best because the end result is exactly the same. The trigger occurs, you complete your readied action and your initiative changes, or, the trigger occurs, you change initiative and then complete your readied action. You can't take AoO anywhere in there in any case unless the opportunity presents itself BEFORE your readied action is triggered, not BY TAKING the readied action.

You can't move, ready a move, later in the round have your readied move triggered, take your readied move, THEN take an immediate attack of opportunity against someone while they are NOT taking actions that would draw an AoO (because whether it's in the limbo of "after your turn but before your next turn" it's not THEIR turn while YOU are taking your readied move and changing initiative - and ipso facto it must be your turn), and then after all that they actually get to take their turn.

I use the phrase "it becomes your turn" quite intentionally because it is YOUR initiative that is being adjusted. You just don't get a FULL turn as such because you deferred at least part of it by Readying. That may not be the way the rules explain it or define it but it's a serviceable means of explaining what's going on. It certainly demonstrates that what the original poster was trying to do wasn't possible while using direct, concrete terminology.

 

[D+1]

Pardon the longwinded response.

She's already initiated the Cast a Spell action, though - it's what triggered your readied action. She can't take back that standard action and make a full-round Withdraw action instead; if she weren't casting a spell, your readied action would never have come up.

She could perhaps abort her casting (losing the slot) and take a move action, if she has a move action left over.

And that makes sense? You can't "take back" the casting and do something else, but you CAN just not cast at all... which would by rights not trigger the readied action just the same?

Readying actions is freaky because 3E+ has done away with declaring actions and then being FORCED to follow through. You take whatever actions you decide when your turn is up and whatever happened prior to your turn NOW is largely irrelevant. But you still need some kind of mechanic for being able to shoot at the first thing that comes through the door without having to wait for your initiative - to interrupt what others are doing on their turn. It does lead to some "time warp" moments but you can't avoid that without breaking down the 3E system and starting over from scratch, building in lots of conditional-completion mechanics for various actions. You START to move, but it was a trigger for a readied action so how much do you actually move? You START to cast, but it was a trigger for a readied action so DO you actually cast?

Example: I'm in a 5' wide corridor and see an enemy some distance away. I ready a move action if he takes a 5' step towards me. He starts his turn with a 5' step towards me. My readied move goes first and my initiative changes. I move up to the square right in front of him - clearly preventing him from moving that 5' step towards me. But does that mean that when it then becomes his turn again he MUST move 5' forward even though he can't? Does it mean he can't move at all? Does it mean that he can't take a 5' step backward and attack with his reach weapon since he had intended to move FORWARD and attack me with it before I ran up to him? That by closing the distance I render him unable to do anything since he had INTENDED to move forward? Does it then matter if he INTENDED to cast rather than move?

It doesn't matter that he actually complete the action he started that triggers my readied action. Unless something I do has an overt effect upon his ability to act when it is his turn he acts as he WANTS to act.

Another example: I ready a move action to run into the midst of a crowd of orcs when my friend the wizard starts casting. He starts casting. I run into the crowd of orcs. Now he had INTENDED to cast Fireball on the orcs. Does he still have to do so? Can he not cast Haste on me instead? Of course he can because he gets to decide what to do on his turn based on everything that's happened up to that point - including my interrupting his originally intended actions with my own actions.

There are specific provisions described in the Ready action for INTERRUPTING a spellcaster to disrupt what he's casting - but then you Ready the action that WILL do so. If I start casting, you take a readied move triggered by my having started casting there's nothing in the description of Ready that says I MUST finish my casting, that if I do cast it MUST be the spell I had intended to cast when I started, etc. Regardless of what triggered your action, when it's my turn I get to act however I want based on all events up to that point.

One more example: You have an action readied for when I start casting. I start casting and your readied action is to say "Boo!" I now have to FINISH casting because you said "Boo!"? Ready exists to interrupt and prevent others from taking actions, not to COMPEL them to take actions.

 

[Hypersmurf]

It doesn't "become your turn?" Let me guess. That's official Sage Speak?

Not at all - it's official Core Rules.

The very first line in the description of the Ready action:

"The ready action lets you prepare to take an action later, after your turn is over but before your next one has begun."

If it's after your turn, and it's before your next turn, then it is not your turn.

-Hyp.

 

[Hypersmurf]

And that makes sense? You can't "take back" the casting and do something else, but you CAN just not cast at all... which would by rights not trigger the readied action just the same?

You did start casting, by using your standard action to take the "Cast a Spell" action. That's what triggered the readied action.

If you change your mind after starting to cast, the spell is interrupted. Just like if someone took an AoO and grappled you, or used a readied action to snatch your Divine Focus away, or cast Silence. In all cases, the spell does not manifest, but the slot is lost, and your standard action has been used.

-Hyp.

 

[kwiqsilver]

Which would mean that a Readied action "I hit him with my sword if he casts a spell" would never actually force a concentration check... because your attack would occur when he wasn't casting. He'd take damage... and then, now that your readied action is over, he'd cast his spell with no chance of losing it.

And to further confuse things, if the move happened entirely before his casting action, he could then choose to cast defensively (since he hasn't acted yet). Or he could do something different, which wouldn't provoke the readied action, so you wouldn't move, which means he could cast without the AoO, which would provoke the readied action...and the world would be sucked into a paradox and explode.

I think it's best to think of them as nearly simultaneous, with the readied action affecting the other action, but not vice versa.

 

[Pax]

Hehe, actually, I think that would muddy it further. As my initial read of that implies that the readied action starts and finishes completely before the triggering action . Now, if it just stated flatly that the readied action interupts the triggering action (with clarification that unless elsewise impeded, the triggering action will still occur), with the readier's initiative being treated as on the same 'count' as the trigger, yet still before it.

"Resolves first" means, the game effects of the action are determined. It does not mean "happens first", in the sense of, "the readied action begins and ends before the triggering action begins". The chain of events woudl be as so:

• Mage says "I cast [such-and-such] spell"
• The Mage's action begins
• Fighter interrupts, and says "My readied action happens, so I move to ... *here*"
• The Fighter's readied action begins
• The Fighter's readied action resolves (Fighter moves his miniature accordingly)
• The Mage's action resolves (spell effects are determined accordingly)

Note that while the readied action resolves first, that does not mean it was STARTED first. Since only the line "The Mage's action begins" would trigger an AoO, the fighter doesn't gain that AoO.

So, pretty much like I said, replacing "happens first" with "is resolved first", should avoid misunderstanding - even by to-a-fault literalists, if they remember the difference between resolving an action first, and starting an action first. ^_^