Reaving Rod and...

[FadedC]

No, you have to hold the rod for the property.

Hmm....do you have a support quote for that? I can't find anything for or against it.

Though if you get properties from merely holding a rod you could just bundle 10 together at get them all.

 

[jedrious]

all of the implements with the exception of holy symbols specify that members of classes that do not use that type of implement cannot benefit from the powers or properties of the items while wielding them, holy symbols are the only one that says holding it uses the powers

 

[Vael]

I don't think you can dual-wield implements like that, but I'm not sure the rules strictly disallow it.

That said, another implementation that gets you the same effect for less cost would be just play a star pact warlock that goes into Doomsayer, use your rod of corruption to spread your curse, then action point ... poof, dead minions and a massive bonus on your next attack role.

 

[Dalzig]

Hmm....do you have a support quote for that? I can't find anything for or against it.

Though if you get properties from merely holding a rod you could just bundle 10 together at get them all.

If you are a member of a class that can use a rod as
an implement, you can apply its enhancement bonus
to the attack and damage rolls of any of your powers
from that class that have the implement keyword, and
you can use a rod’s properties and powers. Members of
other classes gain no benefit from wielding a rod.

Some magic items have a special property that is
constantly active (or active under certain conditions). A
property doesn’t normally require any action to use,
although some properties allow you to turn them off
(or on again).

[link]
3. If you wield a light shield, you can also hold an item as well, although you can’t attack with it. What if that item is an implement? Can you apply its implement bonus to your powers?

No. Using an implement to gain its bonuses is considered attacking with that implement. If you wield a light shield and hold an implement in the same hand, you would not get the implement enhancement bonus to your powers, but you would still benefit from any property that the implement has.

So, you can benefit from the property even if you can't wield the implement, as long as you are holding it.

 

[FadedC]

So, you can benefit from the property even if you can't wield the implement, as long as you are holding it.

Hmm.....well the custserv response definitely strongly supports your interpretation but none of the PHB quotes you made do (in fact the p.239 quote marginaly supports needing to wield it).

So I guess I have to consider it a grey area for now. I used to give a lot of weight to custserv responses, but I've just seen way too many that were later ruled against officially or contradicted by other responses.

 

[Dalzig]

Hmm.....well the custserv response definitely strongly supports your interpretation but none of the PHB quotes you made do (in fact the p.239 quote marginaly supports needing to wield it).

So I guess I have to consider it a grey area for now. I used to give a lot of weight to custserv responses, but I've just seen way too many that were later ruled against officially or contradicted by other responses.

If you must wield a rod to gain its properties, that makes most of the rods useless. Since wielding means you are attacking with the implement... Rod of Corruption only triggers on your own attacks. Rod of Dark Reward never triggers. Rod of Harvest only triggers on your own attacks. Rod of Reaving never triggers.

Hooray! We have two useless rods and two horrible rods!

 

[Nifft]

I can see this argument a bit, but then if you use the Rod of Reaping and Corruption and instead of you "cursing" the BBEG you just curse a minion within 5 squares, killing him and then cursing the BBEG as well. The warlock can then do the normal action to attack the BBEG with curse in tow. *shrugs* I guess I see the point of rangers typically attacking twice and maybe getting Hunter's Quarry (difficult on BBEG and ranged), and rogues getting the higher striker extra damage.

It still feels a bit off to me though. I know you say it helps save the BBEG for half a round or so, but considering considering anyone else would have to actually attack the minion to bring him down, as opposed to just looking at him from across the battlefield, it seems awfully broken. Despite the fact that warlocks might be down on the striker totempole.

You're thinking in the right direction. Warlocks are far below Rangers and Rogues in damage, and they make up for it by getting more cool tricks. One of their cool tricks is using a magic item to bypass a tactical restriction ("must curse closest").

He's paying the same price that a Rogue would pay for a Frost Dagger. This is interesting, because a Frost Dagger, combined with Lasting Frost + Wintertouched, allows a Rogue to bypass several tactical restrictions -- it basically gives him free Combat Advantage next round if he hits a foe this round.

So yeah: it's powerful, it's cool, and that's okay.

Cheers, -- N

 

[jedrious]

If you must wield a rod to gain its properties, that makes most of the rods useless. Since wielding means you are attacking with the implement... Rod of Corruption only triggers on your own attacks. Rod of Dark Reward never triggers. Rod of Harvest only triggers on your own attacks. Rod of Reaving never triggers.

Hooray! We have two useless rods and two horrible rods!

actually Wield means having it available to make attacks, you wield weapons while not attacking all the time, but you're doing more than holding them

 

[Dalzig]

actually Wield means having it available to make attacks, you wield weapons while not attacking all the time, but you're doing more than holding them

So, with the Rogue Weapon Talent, you can wield a shuriken in your left hand, and the bastard sword in your right becomes 1d12. Or if you wield a dagger instead, you get a +1 to any attack. You can also use any rogue power with said bastard sword, because you are wielding that dagger or shuriken.

Or, Armor Piercing Thrust (Fighter 3), if you have a dagger in your left hand and a bastard sword in your right, you can use this power's bonus with the bastard sword because you are wielding the dagger.

 

[keterys]

Fwiw, this came up at Gen Con and was confirmed with some official-ish folks (Mearls was the name I heard, though I wasn't paying enough attention to catch the rest)... I believe it was also suggested as a possible future errata.

I had brought it up with someone as something a bit silly that I suspected would have reaving clarified to 'When you use an action to curse a target' or something like that, and later in the con I got to see it in use for an all-minion encounter (literally, no non-minions. Possibly fastest encounter ever)