Reducing the number of encounters in a day

[Endur]

I'm not sure I've ever seen 8 combats in a single day in any non-computer version of D&D. Given that 6-8 is probably unrealistic for most campaigns, I view the 6-8 comment in the dmg as fiction. f

 

[Tony Vargas]

I'm not sure I've ever seen 8 combats in a single day in any non-computer version of D&D. Given that 6-8 is probably unrealistic for most campaigns, I view the 6-8 comment in the dmg as fiction. f

I readily accept that that's your experience, but WotC must have had good reason to think that 6-8 would not only be possible, but very common, the mode average, at least. Otherwise, they'd've balanced the game differently. If they did have reasonable expectations of combats being consistently fewer than 6/day, that'd imply that they intentionally designed the game to favor classes with more/more-important daily resources, (or since there are so many of those, to punish the remaining less-daily-oriented classes)....

... I suppose you could put that down as 'capturing the feel of the classic game.'

 

[Xeviat]

After further thinking, it seems I may have to reduce the number of the Barbarian's rages per day. By the default rules, with 6 to 8 encounters per day, having 2 rages per day means you can rage for 1/3 to 1/4 of the fights. If I'm instead having 3 to 4 encounters per day, then they have rages for 2/3 to 1/2 of the encounters.

But, there also is a change that the barbarian could lose their rage in a fight. I'm not sure if this is more likely with harder fights. It seems less likely, as there are likely to be more opponents and thus it should be easier to find an opponent to attack. But there could also be more opponents with abilities that could negate rage.

Should I start out with the standard number and then take them away if it proves to be too much, risking making someone feel bad for taking away their toys? Or should I start them at less and then give them more if it proves to be not enough? In all the encounters we've run so far, the Barbarian has never lost their rage.

 

[S'mon]

By the default rules, with 6 to 8 encounters per day

It's not a rule.

 

[Xeviat]

"Default guidelines" then.

 

[Xeviat]

I'm not sure I've ever seen 8 combats in a single day in any non-computer version of D&D. Given that 6-8 is probably unrealistic for most campaigns, I view the 6-8 comment in the dmg as fiction. f

Hence, why I'm looking at adjusting it by not really using "medium" difficulty combats. Many people agree that the system is balanced around this expectation, but it has more to do with the number of short rests than it does the number of encounters. Examples include how many spells the Wizard has at low levels vs the Warlock; the two balance with each other around 2 short rests per day. The daily XP guideline averages out to 6 to 8 encounters per day.

The barbarian is really the only outlier. I'm only worried because it will likely be a power up for the barbarian at the early levels, and then their higher levels may feel like they aren't gaining much (My current barbarian player already feels like the barbarian doesn't gain much at the higher levels).

 

[Tony Vargas]

The barbarian is really the only outlier.

I can see why, in theory. But, what about spells? Sure, there are plenty of instantaneous spells that would logically be drained proportionately faster in longer/tougher fights. Concentration spells would seem to take care of themselves - better in longer fights, but more likely to be disrupted in harder ones. But there are some spells with duration and not concentration that might outperform. Casters will find the best spells for the pacing you settle into. So the barbarian outlier might not be lying out as far as you expect.

I'm only worried because it will likely be a power up for the barbarian at the early levels, and then their higher levels may feel like they aren't gaining much (My current barbarian player already feels like the barbarian doesn't gain much at the higher levels).

You might be able to find other ways to deal with any uneveness like that. For instance, using magic items to boost a character who's 'not getting enough.' Sometimes just tailoring situations to spotlight one sort of character over another. Do you think there might be sorts of combats were rage is just lower-impact? If so, you could have more of them at levels the barbarian seems to be outshining.

But, there also is a change that the barbarian could lose their rage in a fight. I'm not sure if this is more likely with harder fights. It seems less likely, as there are likely to be more opponents and thus it should be easier to find an opponent to attack. But there could also be more opponents with abilities that could negate rage.

What about wave combats. If a wave finishes and only a round or so go by before the next one? Could also help with start-of-combat abilities depending on how you rule they interact with such a lull.

Should I start out with the standard number and then take them away if it proves to be too much, risking making someone feel bad for taking away their toys? Or should I start them at less and then give them more if it proves to be not enough? In all the encounters we've run so far, the Barbarian has never lost their rage.

Unless you're going to tweak every class, I wouldn't tweak any of 'em. Just to avoid creating any appearance that things are screwed up...

 

[Xeviat]

Waves might help, but only maybe a wave of 2 hard encounters, as I'm trying to avoid using "medium" encounters because they're too easy.

I wouldn't mind tweaking every class. I hadn't thought about 1 minute buff spells being more valuable in longer, less frequent fights. But the spellcasters can use their other spell slots for other things; the barbarian is stuck with 1/encounter rage (mostly) with X/days that will exceed the number of encounters per day rather easily.

Maybe I could switch to a rounds per day like Pathfinder?

 

[discosoc]

As a GM, start reading "per day" as "per long rest" and the game makes more sense. By default, a long rest is once per day, but there's nothing stopping you from changing that. My group switched over to to making short rests a once-per day thing, and long rests only happen when they can spend close to 24 hours in relative safety resting up.

 

[Tony Vargas]

I wouldn't mind tweaking every class. I hadn't thought about 1 minute buff spells being more valuable in longer, less frequent fights. But the spellcasters can use their other spell slots for other things

Which means they can gravitate toward whatever spells are most useful under your DMing style. So Rage being more powerful in longer/harder combats, and thus more powerful at low level shouldn't be a problem, at least, not relative to all those daily spell slot resources out there...

the barbarian is stuck with 1/encounter rage (mostly) with X/days that will exceed the number of encounters per day rather easily.

But, yes, I see the issue at higher level, when they might have more rages than encounters per day, that doesn't make the barbarian or the rage underpowered, at all, quite the opposite, but it might make getting another rage/day unappealing, if you already have all you need. Hmmm....

Maybe I could switch to a rounds per day like Pathfinder?

Rounds/day feels a little granular and controlled for an ability like Rage. Concentration (the limiter on spells that might run into the same balance issues) obviously doesn't apply, but some different mechanic/concept might deliver the same sort of limitation. You might add a CON or CON/WIS based limit on how many rounds in a row you can rage (before either dropping out or spending a second rage). You might add a check or save after a certain number of rounds (maybe as few as 3).