D&D (2024) Return to the 3 saves for 1D&D?

[GMforPowergamers]

This is definitely not an 18 stat.
It is a 16 stat with duelling. Or 20 stat without.
You also have an action surge for 4 attacks and you have battlemaster maneuvers... So yes, I expect a bit more.

battle masters are a subclass and no that was an 18 str and longsword and shield or 18 dex and rapier and shield... 4pts from stat and 1 from magic...

 

[tetrasodium]

battle masters are a subclass and no that was an 18 str and longsword and shield or 18 dex and rapier and shield... 4pts from stat and 1 from magic...

Extra attack is a base class feature though & other archetypes get other features. Why are we focused on what a level one fighter with 18 strength does for damage against higher cr monsters?

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Extra attack is a base class feature though & other archetypes get other features. Why are we focused on what a level one fighter with 18 strength does for damage against higher cr monsters?

it wasn't a low level and it wasn't one attack. if you go back it was 2 attacks each for 1d8+5 or a 8d6 elemental save for half

 

[UngeheuerLich]

battle masters are a subclass and no that was an 18 str and longsword and shield or 18 dex and rapier and shield... 4pts from stat and 1 from magic...

Duelling is no subclass ability. So if you want to insist, that a fighter does 1d8+5 damage... I concede.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Duelling is no subclass ability. So if you want to insist, that a fighter does 1d8+5 damage... I concede.

I don't get you at all... dueling says you have 1 weapon in hand, and it's not like you can trade out each fight so yeah you CAN have it

 

[Pauln6]

Duelling is no subclass ability. So if you want to insist, that a fighter does 1d8+5 damage... I concede.

It's a mistake to attempt bald damage comparisons like this. Fighters usually do more damage over the adventuring day. Wizards will spike when the circumstances allow and may set up situations where the fighter does more damage. In my experience, if you only count damage that actually matters (i.e. ignoring damage that doesn't count because the enemy is already at zero hp), the paladin ends up top and the cleric bottom but there isn't as much in it as you think and a cleric with Firestorm in the right scenario will come out top if enough victims are close together.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I don't get you at all... dueling says you have 1 weapon in hand, and it's not like you can trade out each fight so yeah you CAN have it

What?
I really don't get you at all. Youbsaid the fighter has two attacks at 1d8+5. I just said, that is undeselling what a fighter can actually do.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

It's a mistake to attempt bald damage comparisons like this. Fighters usually do more damage over the adventuring day. Wizards will spike when the circumstances allow and may set up situations where the fighter does more damage. In my experience, if you only count damage that actually matters (i.e. ignoring damage that doesn't count because the enemy is already at zero hp), the paladin ends up top and the cleric bottom but there isn't as much in it as you think and a cleric with Firestorm in the right scenario will come out top if enough victims are close together.

I did not say that the fighter is only doing a few points of damage. I think the fighter does a lot more. So I agree with you.

 

[Pauln6]

I did not say that the fighter is only doing a few points of damage. I think the fighter does a lot more. So I agree with you.

Not only this but if crits are going to be downgraded so that extra dice are not doubled, fighter damage might well take over as the top damage dealer.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Not only this but if crits are going to be downgraded so that extra dice are not doubled, fighter damage might well take over as the top damage dealer.

Yes, the fighter would be the winner.
In our games the fighters never had a damage problem and they were never optimized...