Ride by fly by?

[Artoomis]

Tru Dat Liquid.

But it does save having to worry about broken ground and such. Just have to worry about that straight in and out line. Not as easy as one would think.

later

Two issues with Ride by Attack and flying:

1. Technically, you can hardly ever do it due to the "closest point at which you threaten" rule for charge. The closest point is normally one that would force you to go through the enemy's square, which cannot be done without tumble. Obviously, you need to toss that rule in the trash, at least for Ride by Attack.

2. Charging an opponent on the ground when you are airborne can be challenging due to the "straight line" rule. If you start out higher than your enemy, you could end up going right into the ground before you get any significant distance pass them!!

 

[Shallown]

Two issues with Ride by Attack and flying:

1. Technically, you can hardly ever do it due to the "closest point at which you threaten" rule for charge. The closest point is normally one that would force you to go through the enemy's square, which cannot be done without tumble. Obviously, you need to toss that rule in the trash, at least for Ride by Attack.

2. Charging an opponent on the ground when you are airborne can be challenging due to the "straight line" rule. If you start out higher than your enemy, you could end up going right into the ground before you get any significant distance pass them!!

1) sorry I'm not understanding this one. Technically (I use this word when the rules and common sense may conflict) You threaten/can attack inot squares underneath as well as beside you. So you could fly over someone and attack them. You threaten/attack out 5 feet from yourself/or in this case the 10 foot square you occupy (Your mount does and you are assumed to do as well)

2) True. But since flight rules in D&D are rather ambigous/nebulous like many rules it can be done just pass over, beside at any height you still threaten. Its hard to picture something with a 20-25 foot wing span hovering 5 feet off the ground butthe rules allow it with the right manueverability rating (I think good or better). Once agan that's A "Technically"

 

[Ranger REG]

A question in another thread got me thinking... can you use the ride by attack feat on a flying mount? Sure, when its on the ground, but what about flying?

Yes. Regardless of the mount's mode of movement (flying, running, swimming, etc., the rider use the Ride-By Attack to make a charge attack in-between moves (total move must not exceed double the mount's current speed).

 

[Hypersmurf]

1) sorry I'm not understanding this one. Technically (I use this word when the rules and common sense may conflict) You threaten/can attack inot squares underneath as well as beside you. So you could fly over someone and attack them.

Absolutely... if you are at a higher elevation than the opponent to begin with.

If you start off at the same elevation, however, then flying to a point above the opponent is not moving directly to the closest square from which you threaten the opponent. The distance to the square above him is further than the distance to the square immediately in front of him, and therefore the rules of Charging in 3.5 require you to attack from the square immediately in front of him... at which point the straight line requirement dictates that any continuation of that movement proceeds directly through the opponent's square.

And, of course, since the PHB errata, you cannot overrun on a charge...

-Hyp.

 

[Ovinomancer]

Perhaps I am missing something. A charge requires you to move to the closest space from which you can attack your opponent. OK, by the wording, that is a direct line toward the opponent, stopping 5' in front of him. Assuming 5' reach, that is. I can see this. But ride by attack allows you to continue moving 'continuing the line of the charge' only. By this, I think you have to make an overrun every time you ride by, because, by the logic of charge, the line continues throught your opponent. The feat does not give any special dispensation for this continued movement. Is this right?
How does this work?
With this, the only time you could ride by is on a flying mount, starting at exactly the right altitude with respect to your opponent.

 

[Hypersmurf]

With this, the only time you could ride by is on a flying mount, starting at exactly the right altitude with respect to your opponent.

Not necessarily.

As a non-flying example:

If I'm, say, six squares south and one square east of my opponent, then the closest space from which I can attack him is six squares north of my starting position (one square south-east of the opponent). After I attack, continuing the line of my charge would carry on to the north... which is not blocked by my opponent.

However, if I start off six squares south of my opponent, not offset one square east, the line of my charge heads straight through his square.

-Hyp.

 

[pyk]

Not necessarily.

As a non-flying example:

If I'm, say, six squares south and one square east of my opponent, then the closest space from which I can attack him is six squares north of my starting position (one square south-east of the opponent). After I attack, continuing the line of my charge would carry on to the north... which is not blocked by my opponent.

However, if I start off six squares south of my opponent, not offset one square east, the line of my charge heads straight through his square.

-Hyp.

All you're saying is to be careful when one begins the ride-by if on a flying mount, If I read right.

Flying mount in the air cannot ride-by attack a target on the ground, any more than a character that has moved away from a wall can ride-by a target against a wall. The character performing the ride-by has to have suficient space on the direct continuation of the charge to perfrom the charge.

So, a character on a flying mount can perform a ride-by to another flying target, or to a target om the ground if the elevation allows (i.e. target on top of hill/building/etc.).

Now, another option that I think might be an option:

A rider with sufficient skill/feat/whatever is able to have the mount perform an action, and can make a full attack at the appropriate time, all during his own move.

Does this allow the mount to then make a fly-by attack, and allow the rider to still make one standard or full attack during the fly-by? Or is what I'm thinking only applicable to an archer on a mount?

 

[AGGEMAM]

Just to note a minor oddity here. You can actually use Ride-by Attack, and Fly-by Attack in *impossible* positions if you kill or otherwise render your opponent helpless.

 

[Artoomis]

I want to explain more about how the 3.5 charging rules make Ride by Attack nearly impossible, whether on the ground or in the air.

The problem is that the closest square where you threaten your opponent is generally one where, if you continued on, would take you right through an opponent's square. I'll try and demonstrate - X = You, O = bad guy.


Starting position (two or three-dimensional, it doesn't matter)

------
-O----
------
-----X

Closest square marked with an "C"

------
-O----
--C---
-----X




Note how ride-by would be impossible because you'd need to go right through the "O" square. Obviously, you need to toss out the "closest square" rule for at least Ride by Attack.

 

[pyk]

I want to explain more about how the 3.5 charging rules make Ride by Attack nearly impossible, whether on the ground or in the air.

The problem is that the closest square where you threaten your opponent is generally one where, if you continued on, would take you right through an opponent's square. I'll try and demonstrate - X = You, O = bad guy.

-------

Note how ride-by would be impossible because you'd need to go right through the "O" square. Obviously, you need to toss out the "closest square" rule for at least Ride by Attack.

Now, for those of us just not fluent in 3.5 (I still play 3.0 only) why does it matter going through the opponents square? Is there a new rule in 3.5 not allowing this? I know the "no two medium or larger can occupy the same square" but the ride-by is not going to occupy the square, merely travel through it.