Rogue 2nd level utility an encounter power

[Mercule]

Hey, look at it from the other side. If some guy runs past me, I get a whack at him with my sword. Now if he suddenly does a backflip, for some reason I can't target him? Get real. Maybe he can fool me and my warriors with that trick once, but next time he tries it we'll be ready.

This seems like a fair explanation, to me.

I still hope there are some other "agility" tricks for swashbuckling types, though.

 

[Just Another User]

So you'd have a check versus a monster's attack bonus to see if he gets a chance to hit you, and if the monster makes it he then gets to make an attack versus your AC to see if he hits you. Basically it would amounts to making the monster make two attack rolls, and both have to be good. It seems like a more efficient way to do it would be to give a bonus to AC against opportunity attacks, or maybe make it so opportunity attacks do only half damage.

if you want a single roll there are various possibilites, for example

a- you roll acrobatics vs monster reflex defense. If you fail you are hit.

or

b- monsters attack vs your acrobatics rather then your AC (or whatever), this trick is supposed to be used by lightly armoured, nimble characteres so it would make sense

b- bis monsters attack your reflex rather that your AC (or whatever)

as a possible rule, to add an extra risk, if you are hit, you stop moving where you are. You
are supposed to be tumbling, jumping, back flipping, etc, it make sense that if you are hit you lose your momentum.

Of course, for a definitive answer, we should see the definitive rules. Until then we are building on clouds.

 

[Stalker0]

The way I rationale tumble is the same way I rationalize martial powers, like brutal strike.

Why can't a fighter make a huge powerful swing more than 1/day? The answer is that he can, but in general it would be suicide. The amount of time, effort, and recovery after the move would leave you painfully vulnerable to attack. So you only use it when you can, and that's rare.

Tumble is similar. Sure tumbling you can do all the time. But doing it in combat when there are arrows flying, dragons breathing fire, things exploding, etc is not something you just do. You have to find the right oppurtunity to make it work.

 

[Stalker0]

The problem is that 3.x tumble , like everything with a fixed DC (I'm looking at you Concentration), was just too easy after a cetain level. The solution would have been making it harder, maybe an opposed check against the monster's attack, or something similiar.

Which actually is a terrible way to balance it in 3.5 The reason being is that as levels go up, attack bonuses tend to increase quickly. So a rogue has to invest full ranks in tumble to get any benefit of it.

Second, as levels increase, the rogue's hitpoints and AC do not keep up with the power of monsters he's often fighting. Which means every AOO is more painful at high levels.

If I'm 2nd level and I miss a tumble check, that's bad. If I miss it at 20th, that could be fatal.

However, because things scale more smoothly in 4e (supposedly) such a mechanic could work. A trained rogue in tumble is going to maintain a certain bonus over the attack role of an equal level warrior, so an opposed roll should have an approximately equal chance of success at any level you compare it too.