Roles are so LIMITING!

[Mirtek]

The pregen warlock's best damage-dealing at-will power does 1d10 + Cha (+ 1d6 if the target has been cursed).

The pregen fighter's best damage-dealing at-will power does 1d10 + Str + 2 (+ Str again if there's an adjacent target).

Best I can figure the 'striker' role essentially means "pick your target," not "do the most damage".

Which are merely first level powers. A first level pre-4e wizard also deals a lot less damage than a pre-4e fighter

With all this talk about equality with these classes the defender needs to give up something if he already more hp/level and through his armor a better main defences (as I guess most attacks will target AC).

Otherwise why not give all of them equal hp and equal AC?

 

[brislove]

Judgement of wisdom/Crusader provide a large DPS increase to your raid, however these are things that become with better gear since they are both effectively percentage based. Casters can cast more, and they crit more, its like giving your whole raid a boomkin .

nihilum said that they didn't feel that hybrids were worth bringing until they are reached a certain level of gear, then the %increase for the rest of the raid would make up the difference between having a few people just do really weak damage. On a final note, If I could play D&D 2-3 games a week in the middle of the night I wouldn't pay wow.

on the roles of 4e. I'm interested to see if the talents break roles to some degree. I'm sure fighters will always have ways to keep guys near them/punish them for moving. however it's entirely possible that they have talent lines that are more damage focused.

If I recall correctly, wizards said that people would be able to do their role no matter what, and then you have options to do whatever ELSE you want to do with your character.

 

[Counterspin]

Yes, but the fighter strikes against AC, which will almost always be a harder roll than a roll versus one of the other three defenses.

 

[Kzach]

I'm usually third or fourth, since I'm doing things like healing on demand, keeping judgements up, buffing, fearing undead, etc. It's utterly amazing how the flexibility provided by a ret paladin has helped, and we scale even better in a 25-man raid. Until recently we haven't had good gear, though, which hurt badly.

If you're third or fourth on the damage meters, then your rogues, wizards, hunters and warlocks suck.

Either that, or I'm glad I stopped playing WoW when I did, 'cause nobody but rogues should be in the top two or three and ret pallies should be nowhere near there.

 

[Pinotage]

Now, he's got an estimated... what, we got a rough idea from a leak about the druid, it was something like 80 combat tricks?

I look at this and I see an expansion of detail that really excites me.

Well, narrowing the focus was probably necessary in order to create the detail and facets we now get to enjoy. So apparently my fun required the destruction of your fun. Sorry.

Thanks for the clarification. I'm not sure I completely agree with you, but at least I understand your point. It's speculation, of course, that the 80 combat tricks will define role. So far many of them just seem to be weapon attacks with different names aimed at different defenses with different damage. I guess to me role has a broader definition than combat only, and hopefully once we get to see the social rules, the potential of the rules will come out fully. In either event, I'm sure it won't stop any of us from having fun.

Pinotage

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

If you're third or fourth on the damage meters, then your rogues, wizards, hunters and warlocks suck.

I'm very well-geared (S3 arena, best available ret stuff in the game), and some of them do stink and/or don't go all-out.

Either that, or I'm glad I stopped playing WoW when I did, 'cause nobody but rogues should be in the top two or three and ret pallies should be nowhere near there.

Oh, you're glad. Now top DPS is almost always hunters, because Blizzard Hates Melee*. Though a WWS parser apparently showed that rogues were still on top.

Brad

* - Many boss fights have a Hokey-Pokey phase, as the boss whirlwinds, nukes, or in some other manner pours out damage around them, requiring the melee types to run out. There are some fights that require the entire raid to move, and a very few that require ranged to move but not melee.

 

[Rex Blunder]

Shouldn't this be in the "WoW" subforum inside the "4e is turning into WoW" subforum?

 

[Lacyon]

Which are merely first level powers. A first level pre-4e wizard also deals a lot less damage than a pre-4e fighter

The first level wizard deals more damage than any other pregen whenever he can target at least two enemies.

With all this talk about equality with these classes the defender needs to give up something if he already more hp/level and through his armor a better main defences (as I guess most attacks will target AC).

The defender gives up choice of targets (or rather, fails to gain it to the degree that strikers and controllers do).

Otherwise why not give all of them equal hp and equal AC?

Because they get other things instead. Like mobility/range, AoE effects, and buffs/healing.

 

[Brown Jenkin]

Here's an "important" question: how do you pronounce "niche"?

I say it so it rhymes with witch, but I've heard people say it like "neesh". Yeah, I suppose a quick trip to a dictionary would help, but I'd rather know what people actually say, rather than what the dictionary says.

Much like Potato or Tomato, it depends on local dialects. Either would be fine, but "neesh" might be considered more pretentious by some (of course using words like pretentious might be considered pretentious as well).

 

[RigaMortus2]

Either that, or I'm glad I stopped playing WoW when I did, 'cause nobody but rogues should be in the top two or three and ret pallies should be nowhere near there.

Says you...