RtTToEE

[Roland Delacroix]

FIRST please put (spoilers) in the title of the thread, just for the idiots who thought 'Oh, i thought it was a spoiler free RttToEE thread!'

The module as written IS a hack, and a very intense one. But there is NO reason why it can't be more RP orientated. Throughout the beginning and middle there are many encounters that begin 'The orcs attack anyone they see....' or somesuch. For a more RP game, simply throw that out and run them like you normally would. IE: not paranoic homicidal maniacs.

For example, the hobgoblin camp in the old temple. Their members are periodically kidnapped and impressed as slave/guards for the cult. I can easily see them agreeing to work with a party willing to stop the cult. Hobgoblins are LE after all, there's no reason the party couldn't hammer out an agreement between Hommlet and the Hobgoblins. This could even lead to a very intrigue ridden game as the undercover cultists in town use their power to try and stop such an alliance. They don't want their enemies getting stronger.

Again, the CRM rebel orcs. They are stuck between hostile former masters (the cult) and miles of monsters. I think they would gladly take any chance they could to get out of the CRM, even if that means helping a party of adventurers. There are many exaples like this in the CRM, including the un-allied green dragon. Dragons aren't dumb, they don't want the world to blow up either. That's where they keep all their stuff!!

And of course the CRM elemental temple intrigues. A smart party could easily ally with one of the temples, probably the strong water temple or fire, fight the other strong temple. End result: 2 strong temples are now weak, and all the party has to do is mop up.

The Triad. Once they recognize the party as a threat one of them could easily become an RP based enemy. They physically outgun the party so much maybe they just get their kicks by setting the party up for a crime, or discrediting them, etc. When they solve the mystery/clear their name/whatever then the Triad can get pissed and come after them. But the most fun challenges are often those that exert the mind.

So, as written it's a hack. But just by playing a very few encounters differentlly you could expand it to be a really in depth RP game. To do so though you will need a party that will pursue that instead of just killing everything like Monte suggests. Oh, also if your party does go the RP route you will need to give out RP XP to overcome the lack of killing expected in the game.

 

[Monte At Home]

So, as written it's a hack. But just by playing a very few encounters differentlly you could expand it to be a really in depth RP game. To do so though you will need a party that will pursue that instead of just killing everything like Monte suggests.

Where in the book do I suggest that?

 

[Frosty]

Where in the book do I suggest that?

[Joke] I seem to recall a passage in the module that says "Please feel free to kill everything in sight." Or maybe I was under influence...[/Joke]

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Yes it's a great hack & slash, old school dungeon crawling mega module! My players love it and so do I. There are places where you can interact with NPC's but it's combat orientated as all good adventures should be.

 

[Frosty]

Yup, it's great. And remember not to put words in people's mouth now, you hear?

 

[Crypt King]

Yeah, all good adventures... no I don't think so.

The adventure is heavy on hack, and role playing in an adventure should be more then deals of manipulation to get around killing. It takes a little work but you can make it do what you want, change encounters and such, add stuff like the Omen, sorry Tharizidun's baby adventure from Dungeon to give a more RP intense side adventure.

It makes a nice basis for a campaign, if you want to put some effort into making it more then the big dungeon crawl it is.

I'm trying to work how I could integrate it into the other published adventures and a couple of side treks to make it a campaign.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Yeah, all good adventures... no I don't think so.

The adventure is heavy on hack, and role playing in an adventure should be more then deals of manipulation to get around killing.

Well I wanted to put a love triangle in it but my players told me to shape up or they would get a new DM. The only work I've really had to do other than changing some encounters was figuring out a way to seperate the EEE(EEG) & T. They weren't supposed to be the same.

 

[Roland Delacroix]

Where in the book do I suggest that?

Hmm, i knew that was gonna cause me trouble but forgot to edit it. I meant the suggestion is implied by the almost complete lack of material that considers a roleplaying solution to just killing. Sorry for not clarifying.

The way every single encounter is set up to attack the PC's. Most everything attacks the players on site, except the very few 'good' npc's such as Spugnoir. Reading it twice this weekend i saw countless 'she attacks anyone she doesn't recognize' and 'he instantly attacks'. The only place I saw a non fight taken into consideration was Spugnoirs reaction, the tower Hobgoblins in the old temple, and a few guards who didn't question those in robes. Not too many among several hundred encounters.

The most clear indicator is the complete lack of support for an RP orientated party. The monsters and npc's are generally simply placed, with very little about how they would react to different non-fight situations. Unless the DM was very good, I could see him easily assuming these were all meant to be fights, and just have the monsters attack. Since Draxus asked, i wanted to make it clear to him that he could ignore this asumption and make the module as RP oriented as he wished.

Of course you couldn't take all the options into account, you had limited space. But I think a sidebar saying 'Hey! Your players can make friends here too!' and a sentence or two for a few encounters would have helped immensly. Something as simple as 'Vranthis covets the high priests gold amulet and hates the kuo-toas, he might be willing to aid a strong party who kills them' or whatever would have made the module more RP friendly. Still, if a DM already knows to expand in that direction its a great campaign.

 

[Monte At Home]

Well, obviously you're entitled to your opinion, but we do indeed disagree.

The whole premise of the Crater Ridge Mines is that there are four different centers of power that can be pitted against one another if you convince them to do so. Over and over again, each encounter with various guards and whatnot points out that you can bluff your way past them if you are disguised as cultists.

Sure, there's a lot of fighting in this adventure. No doubt about it. But the people who complain about how the adventure is too tough are usually also the people who just try to fight there way through the whole thing. It was made as tough as it was, in fact, to discourage mindless "kill everything in the place" kinds of attitudes.

And, as someone else pointed out, Hommlet and Rastor are both filled with people to interact with.

It was my intent, as I was writing a "Return to" product, to present a module in the 1st Edition tradition. That is to say, present a well-detailed place, with stuff going on and notes detailing how the people in that place might react to certain events, and just leave it at that. Let the PCs decide what to do there and the (hopefully well-armed) DM deal with it.

It's certainly different from other adventures I've written, like say Dead Gods, which is very event-driven and plot-heavy. In the adventure I just finished, the Banewarrens, I try to merge the two styles and came up with some new ways to do just that.

 

[Morrow]

Questions, Thoughts, and Spoilers

...It takes a little work but you can make it do what you want, change encounters and such, add stuff like the Omen, sorry Tharizidun's baby adventure from Dungeon to give a more RP intense side adventure.

It makes a nice basis for a campaign, if you want to put some effort into making it more then the big dungeon crawl it is.

I'm trying to work how I could integrate it into the other published adventures and a couple of side treks to make it a campaign.

Which Dungeon did the 'Tharizidun's baby' adventure appear in? Are there any other Tharizidun-centric Dungeon adventures that might mesh well with RttTOEE?

Some folks have expressed concern that if they add additional material and side-trecks to the Temple that their characters will advance too quickly. However, a quick flip through the adventure reveals forty-some-odd encounter areas (mostly in the Crater Ridge mines) that can be removed without harming the rest of the adventure. That's a whole boatload of potential experience that can now come from whatever story elements you want to add. The adventure is about Tharizidun's flunkies, after a couple of random encounters the players will get the idea that there are other nasty things about, and the displacer beasts, cloakers, darkmantles, destrachans, deinonychus, green dragons, random gratuitous fire creatures, and whatnot won't really be missed.

Of course, that's just my opinion.

Morrow