Rules for pistols and muskets

[Eben]

I think Joshua is right: you can hardly compare 20th century rifles to flinlock muskets. I think it's essentially a matter of ballistics. The projectile fired from a rifle is far superior to that fired from a musket. Early rifles fired more acurate, but it took a lot more care to load them properly and when the were loaded like a musket, they were even less accurate.

 

[Greatwyrm]

I think Joshua is right: you can hardly compare 20th century rifles to flinlock muskets. I think it's essentially a matter of ballistics.

Absolutely. For the most part, earlier weapons fired much larger rounds and used a larger powder charge than modern weapons do. Accurate or not, if they hit you, you were in deep ****.

 

[Frostmarrow]

The term "bullet proof" comes from the practice to look for a dent in armor caused by a bullet. As sign of quality the armor smith would finish his work by shooting a bullet into it. If the armor stopped the bullet he could sell it to a discerning customer.

At least that's what they said on History channel the other day.

 

[Frostmarrow]

In gaming terms I guess bullet proof is an add-on just like masterworked, that allows the wearer to benefit from the armor. Non-bullet proof armor would not protect from guns (ranged touch).

 

[Greatwyrm]

In gaming terms I guess bullet proof is an add-on just like masterworked, that allows the wearer to benefit from the armor. Non-bullet proof armor would not protect from guns (ranged touch).

I like the sound of this. Would you price it the same as Masterwork?

 

[mmadsen]

If the rules for crossbows work for you, the DMG's rules for blackpowder firearms should work too.

Here's a snippet of an interesting article I found on the Strategy Page:

By 1500 infantrymen had three different missile weapons available to them. There was the arquebus, a relatively light firearm manageable by one man, as well as the very common crossbow, and the longbow, which was mostly limited to use by the English. Technically the arquebus was inferior to both the other two weapons in range, accuracy, and rate of fire, while the longbow was generally superior to the crossbow.

Characteristics of Infantry Missile Weapons, c. 1500:

[Color=white]Weapon   Weight Proj Wt  "MV"    KE   RPM  Range 
          (kg)  (grms)  (m/sec) (jls)       (m) 
Arquebus  6.5     45      30      20   1     25 
Crossbow  3.5    125      45     127  1-2    50 
Longbow   3.0     75      45      76  2-6    50[/Color]

 

[mmadsen]

The rules in the DMG are far too basic and simple...

Out of curiosity, where do you think they need extra complexity?

...not to mention that no one in my group would even consider taking an exotic weapon proficiency for those obviously underpowered weapons.

If you want common firearms, just make them martial, or even simple, weapons, and consider dropping the price. Real firearms were easy to use and relatively cheap.

Also, you can carry a lot more firearm ammunition (powder and ball) than you can carry arrows or bolts.

 

[The Little Raven]

I seem to remember that the longbow could punch through plate mail without an issue. The Welsh longbow, in particular, was known for its ability to reduce armored calvary to nothing. If you are going to make armor less effective towards firearms, then the longbow should gain the same benefits.

 

[Kobold Avenger]

The Arbalest (Heavy crossbow) could penetrate armor pretty easily, and I do remember that back in 2.5e with Combat & Tactics crossbows did ignore the AC from armors along with guns. And Plate Mail armor did prove to be useless when Russian knights were defeated by Mongol invaders with their horse archers.

But my main reason for having my house rules on armor (which can be made easy enough by simply rewriting the table on armor stats with two additional columns) is that I don't really want everyone going around in plate mail just because they can. That's why I'm using class defense bonuses for all classes, because I want the PCs to wear whatever the players feel the characters should wear. There will be some special armor in my campaign, but it's more like using special equipment (& then there's mechanical steam-powered suits, which I only see those wanting to invest in using them putting those on).

But as far as I see things in my campaigns, soldiers do dress up in uniforms with colors like blue or red, wear funny hats and typically fire bullets when standing in a line with other soldiers. Though some of the tactics are a little more modern due to the presence of magic and airships, so not too much slow marching towards the enemy.

 

[Frostmarrow]

I like the sound of this. Would you price it the same as Masterwork?

Oo I don't know. Even in a world that has fire-arms (such as AEGs Swashbuckling Adventures) guns are still pretty rare. You can only be really good at one thing and I've found that most people like to get stuck into melee. Therfore I would say that bullet-proof is worth less than masterworked. Masterworked is always useful but bullet proof is just useful... say one third of the time. +100 gp seems appropriate to me.

The good news is that by making it an add on all the rules for making bullet proof armor is covered by the normal craft rules.