D&D (2024) Rules Glossary packet6

[tetrasodium]

Yes so? The players get their short rest unless they are in an area were they wouldn’t be able to.

The rule is written to remove adjudication of the "wouldn't"

Spoiler: Packet6 short rest

A Short Rest is a 1-hour period of downtime, during which a creature does nothing more strenuous than eating, drinking, reading, dozing,
and standing watch.
BENEFITS OF THE REST
To start a Short Rest, you must have at least 1 Hit Point. When you finish the rest, you gain the following benefits:
Spend Hit Dice. You can spend one or more of your Hit Dice to regain Hit Points. For each Hit
Die you spend in this way, roll the die, and add your Constitution modifier to it. You regain Hit
Points equal to the total (minimum of 1 Hit Point). You can decide to spend an additional Hit Die after each roll.
Special Feature. Some features are recharged by a Short Rest. If you have such a feature, it recharges in the way specified in its description.
INTERRUPTING THE REST
A Short Rest is stopped by the following interruptions:
• Rolling Initiative
• Casting a spell other than a cantrip
• Taking any damage
An interrupted Short Rest confers no benefits, and it must be started over to confer any.

Spoiler: packet6 long rest

A Long Rest is a period of extended downtime—at least 8 hours long—available to any creature. During a Long Rest, you sleep for at least 6 hours and perform no more than 2 hours of light activity, such as reading, talking, eating, or standing watch.
During the sleep, you have the Unconscious condition.
BENEFITS OF THE REST
To start a Long Rest, you must have at least 1 Hit Point. When you finish the rest, you gain the following benefits:
Regain All HP. You regain all lost Hit Points.
Regain All HD. You regain all spent Hit Dice.
HP Max Restored. If your Hit Point Maximum was reduced, it returns to normal.
Ability Scores Restored. If any of your Ability Scores were reduced, they return to normal.
Exhaustion Reduced. If you have the Exhaustion condition, your level of exhaustion decreases by 1.
Special Feature. Some features are recharged by a Long Rest. If you have such a feature, it recharges in the way specified in its description.
After you finish a Long Rest, you must wait at least 16 hours before starting another one.

Without invoking fiat what is "an area were they wouldn’t be able to." simply go back to "so with that done, we take a long/short rest"? Do you have a lot of adventures set in a volcano actively the process of erupting?

Current rule don’t even mention the needs of hands to climb or swim.
I guess that that designers consider the players smart enough to figure out the use of hands by themselves.

Wow... It's a good thing d&d is a single player exercise in story writing where players get to decide that for themselves?.. oh wait.... it's not up to a player to decide

 

[Krachek]

Wow... It's a good thing d&d is a single player exercise in story writing where players get to decide that for themselves?.. oh wait.... it's not up to a player to decide

Then the DM can do his job and take a decision and add his tone to the game. DMs that don’t take any decision will be first to be replace by AI DM.

 

[tetrasodium]

Then the DM can do his job and take a decision and add his tone to the game. DMs that don’t take any decision will be first to be replace by AI DM.

You are avoiding the problem. The rule wording invites a fight with the GM if they attempt to do so. It does that to such an extreme that own defense of that wording previously gave the authority of making that decision to the player despite reluctantly admitting the GM has a role in the process now..

 

[Krachek]

You are avoiding the problem. The rule wording invites a fight with the GM if they attempt to do so. It does that to such an extreme that own defense of that wording previously gave the authority of making that decision to the player despite reluctantly admitting the GM has a role in the process now..

The wording of some rule won’t change the core status of the DM. Those rules update are not more or less incline toward rule lawyer fights.
DM will have to assume his role anyway.

 

[Krachek]

Help Action: D Minus There is no mention of actually needing to make any sort of check or the GM having any say whatsoever over any part of the process. Alice the player simply chooses a skill or tool proficiency of her choice and bob automatically gets advantage on his next check with it or Dave automatically gets advantage on the next attack against an opponent no matter the opponent. Is the goal here to remove the GM?

Do you read the last sentence?
The DM has final say on whether your assistance is possible.

 

[tetrasodium]

Do you read the last sentence?
The DM has final say on whether your assistance is possible.

Spoiler: packet6 help action

When you take the Help action, you do one of the
following:
Assist Ability Check. Choose one of your skill or
tool proficiencies and one ally who can
perceive you. You give Advantage to the next
ability check that ally makes with the chosen
skill or tool. This benefit expires if the ally
doesn’t use it before the start of your next
turn. To give this assistance, you must be near
enough to the ally to assist verbally or
physically when the ally makes the check. The
DM has final say on whether your assistance is
possible.
Assist Attack Roll. You momentarily distract an
enemy within 5 feet of you, granting
Advantage to the next attack roll by one of
your allies against that enemy. This benefit
expires at the start of your next turn.

There are two ways of using the help action. The phrase you note would need to be placed prior to the colon or in both options to apply to both. That phrase is only present in the ability check section.

 

[Krachek]

Spoiler: packet6 help action

When you take the Help action, you do one of the
following:
Assist Ability Check. Choose one of your skill or
tool proficiencies and one ally who can
perceive you. You give Advantage to the next
ability check that ally makes with the chosen
skill or tool. This benefit expires if the ally
doesn’t use it before the start of your next
turn. To give this assistance, you must be near
enough to the ally to assist verbally or
physically when the ally makes the check. The
DM has final say on whether your assistance is
possible.
Assist Attack Roll. You momentarily distract an
enemy within 5 feet of you, granting
Advantage to the next attack roll by one of
your allies against that enemy. This benefit
expires at the start of your next turn.

There are two ways of using the help action. The phrase you note would need to be placed prior to the colon or in both options to apply to both. That phrase is only present in the ability check section.

The assist attack is almost the same as the actual rule where the DM has
also nothing to say:

Alternatively, you can aid a friendly creature in attacking a creature within 5 feet of you. You feint, distract the target, or in some other way team up to make your ally’s attack more effective. If your ally attacks the target before your next turn, the first attack roll is made with advantage.

The UA rule to assist attack is just more clear. But that´s debatable.
So overall the UA rules give actually more power and decision to the DM.

 

[Krachek]

Short rest: F minus The characters don't actually need to do anything, no study no prayer, no first aid, etc... just quietly hole up in a closet & try not to breathe too loud in the hopes that there are no closet checking patrols & complain that it's not believable that there would be patrols checking the closets or whatever so often. Dresign forcing Half minute hero on the GM needs to die

I don’t think it is the game mechanics that need to dictate the game pace or the emphasis the DM want to make on resting.
Describing and role playing what the PCs are doing during a rest is a matter of play style and mood.
Checking for random encounter is the DM job, the resting rule has not to describe how easily a rest can be break.

 

[tetrasodium]

I don’t think it is the game mechanics that need to dictate the game pace or the emphasis the DM want to make on resting.
Describing and role playing what the PCs are doing during a rest is a matter of play style and mood.
Checking for random encounter is the DM job, the resting rule has not to describe how easily a rest can be break.

You are making quite the circuitous route around the void in rest mechanics there. Players don't need to go anywhere or do anything during a rest & the returns on a successful rest are massive to the point where the closest analog is often on par with video game console commands/cheat codes. There's no bar they need to meet in action circumstance or support & no real chance of a death spiral. Players are given every reason to just shrug off any interruption like so.


When players do this it pretty much holds the campaign hostage. Players know the GM won't burn down their campaign with a TPK or throw out the adventure too many times to rebuild things if the group shrugs off doom clocks.

If you look back at past editions where players did not recover ALL hp, ALL ability score reductions ALL max HP reduction or have things like HD they could spend you can see classes that needed to actively do something* during a rest & didn't receive complete reset button results that obliviated death spiral possibility. Those meant that the GM had a credible leg to stand on when they said "you are in an area that you wouldn't be able to rest" as someone suggested the GM simply do through fiat earlier in the thread. That stonewall given to players is even reinforced with the continuation of short rest classes in this packet and an incomplete long rest that lasted at least an hour automatically granting a successful short rest.

* pray/study/provide care/get good sleep/etc from class to class.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

The rule is written to remove adjudication of the "wouldn't"

Spoiler: Packet6 short rest

A Short Rest is a 1-hour period of downtime, during which a creature does nothing more strenuous than eating, drinking, reading, dozing,
and standing watch.
BENEFITS OF THE REST
To start a Short Rest, you must have at least 1 Hit Point. When you finish the rest, you gain the following benefits:
Spend Hit Dice. You can spend one or more of your Hit Dice to regain Hit Points. For each Hit
Die you spend in this way, roll the die, and add your Constitution modifier to it. You regain Hit
Points equal to the total (minimum of 1 Hit Point). You can decide to spend an additional Hit Die after each roll.
Special Feature. Some features are recharged by a Short Rest. If you have such a feature, it recharges in the way specified in its description.
INTERRUPTING THE REST
A Short Rest is stopped by the following interruptions:
• Rolling Initiative
• Casting a spell other than a cantrip
• Taking any damage
An interrupted Short Rest confers no benefits, and it must be started over to confer any.

Spoiler: packet6 long rest

A Long Rest is a period of extended downtime—at least 8 hours long—available to any creature. During a Long Rest, you sleep for at least 6 hours and perform no more than 2 hours of light activity, such as reading, talking, eating, or standing watch.
During the sleep, you have the Unconscious condition.
BENEFITS OF THE REST
To start a Long Rest, you must have at least 1 Hit Point. When you finish the rest, you gain the following benefits:
Regain All HP. You regain all lost Hit Points.
Regain All HD. You regain all spent Hit Dice.
HP Max Restored. If your Hit Point Maximum was reduced, it returns to normal.
Ability Scores Restored. If any of your Ability Scores were reduced, they return to normal.
Exhaustion Reduced. If you have the Exhaustion condition, your level of exhaustion decreases by 1.
Special Feature. Some features are recharged by a Long Rest. If you have such a feature, it recharges in the way specified in its description.
After you finish a Long Rest, you must wait at least 16 hours before starting another one.

Without invoking fiat what is "an area were they wouldn’t be able to." simply go back to "so with that done, we take a long/short rest"? Do you have a lot of adventures set in a volcano actively the process of erupting?


Wow... It's a good thing d&d is a single player exercise in story writing where players get to decide that for themselves?.. oh wait.... it's not up to a player to decide

If the players are in an area were enemies are actively patrolling, there are hazards, or they are under some kind of time pressure they likely won’t be able to rest. A long rest is basically impossible in an active enemy base, and most groups will have to leave and come back. None of what you posted supported your argument in any way.