D&D General Run Away!

[GMMichael]

Don't get it, don't know who that is.

That's Cid. He's a mechanic (engineer) who famously (?) died to let the "PCs" get away.

by the rules running stinks.

Really? If the DM announces combat, by the rules, wouldn't the DM just announce that combat is over?

However I find the OTHER end is the real problem. If I want to have a monster/npc run I need to give them a big boost. If I even manage to start my turn not engaged in melee (good luck) and I double move... maybe I can get away if no one has ranged attacks.

Ranged attacks don't work if the target has cover.

 

[iserith]

Really? If the DM announces combat, by the rules, wouldn't the DM just announce that combat is over?

That's essentially how the Chase rules work in D&D 5e. When the DM decides the situation will turn into a chase, perhaps because the PCs want to run away from the monsters or vice versa, then the chase is on!

 

[CleverNickName]

I think I'm going to make Retreat into a minigame in my next campaign. It's still in development, but I wanted something that would be it works a bit like this.

• Each side has an Evasion score and a Pursuit score. Evasion and Pursuit are both equal to the average Intelligence score or the average Dexterity score of their respective group, whichever is higher. (This minigame uses Dexterity to simulate quick reflexes and Intelligence to simulate quick thinking, and it assumes that both are equally helpful during a chase.)
• Chase begins when all members of one side inform the DM that they are going to "run away" at the beginning of their turn, and the other side informs the DM that they are going to "give chase" at the beginning of their turn. Obviously if one side runs away and the other side doesn't give chase, we're done here.
• When the chase scene begins, I switch to a special linear battle mat. I use one single token to represent the the group that is fleeing (the Quarry), and one single token to represent the group that is chasing them (the Hunters). This minigame assumes that both sides are trying to "stay together," not necessarily shoulder-to-shoulder but close enough that they can help each other as they move. These two tokens are placed 8 squares apart; one square is approximately 60 feet.
• Each side makes an opposed Evasion and Pursuit check, by rolling 1d20 and adding the applicable modifier. The group with the faster movement speed makes their roll at Advantage. This is not combat--no attack rolls or save throws will be made, no spells will be cast, no magic items activated.
• If the Hunters win, the two tokens move 1 square closer together. If the Quarry wins, they move 1 square further apart.
• If the tokens are ever 15 or more squares apart, the scene ends with the Quarry safely away. If the tokens are ever 0 squares apart, we switch back to a standard battle mat, I place the tokens randomly on the board, we roll initiative, and combat begins anew.

I'm still tweaking it, but this is more or less what I have in mind for escape in my upcoming campaign.

Is it perfect? Nope, not even close.
Does it account for (Favorite Tactic)? Probably not.
Is it a guaranteed escape plan? No. There's no such thing.
Is it better than the DMG rules for evasion and pursuit? I think so, but YMMV.

 

[p_johnston]

Maybe it's just my group but in my experience players HATE losing. It doesn't mean they won't laugh at a TPK later but it does mean that they will let multiple PC's die and fight to the bitter end for a 1% chance of winning rather then run away and lose the fight.

I have had people

• Kill themselves driving a car at an NPC to try and defeat them after said NPC was explicitly disabling and knocking out the rest of the party instead of killing them.
• Sell their soul to Asmodeus to win a fight rather then just... leave.
• In 13th age after finally fleeing and accepting the campaign lose decide to give up on the campaign rather then flee again (the campaign lose was that a PC died while the party had in their possession an item to revive them.)

Never, ever, ever plan on your players being willing to flee. Let them know it's an option, make it possible to do so but never rely on them doing so.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Really? If the DM announces combat, by the rules, wouldn't the DM just announce that combat is over?

you cut the part where I said that was the only thing they did...

Ranged attacks don't work if the target has cover.

laugh in move actiom.

 

[iserith]

I've had three recent retreats come from a group I play with occasionally (as opposed to my regular group).

In the first retreat, the paladin and barbarian were just getting eaten alive by a swarm of acidic beetles and a core spawn crawler. The rogue and the druid, sensing defeat upon them, fell back to around 60 feet. The paladin and barbarian died and, due to their distance, the rogue and druid were able to get away since the creatures' senses were limited to a particular radius.

In the second occurrence, the PCs delved deeper and found the hive of the beetles that killed their friends, threw them some rations, and ran past the hive to another area to explore.

Just past that hive, they found a flooded section of the dungeon and decided to go in with only a dancing lights spell for light and the caster up front (you heard me right). The sorcerer was killed by a water weird, plunging the whole mazelike area into darkness. The party ran (or rather swam) with the druid splitting from the party. The water weird chased the druid down and killed him while the others got away.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Just past that hive, they found a flooded section of the dungeon and decided to go in with only a dancing lights spell for light and the caster up front (you heard me right). The sorcerer was killed by a water weird, plunging the whole mazelike area into darkness. The party ran (or rather swam) with the druid splitting from the party. The water weird chased the druid down and killed him while the others got away.

that.... that is a story (for good or ill) that will last for years.

 

[Grogg of the North]

This has been turning over in my head and I've been wondering how many times the characters in question have a back up plan. An answer to "What happens if I get caught?" When you have to run away, how many times do players say something like "I toss a bag of caltrops/marbles behind me as I run" or "I throw a smoke stick at my feet and flee"? I know this advice is going to vary from table to table, but in my experience saying something like that tends to tip things in your favor when escaping. Because the DM recognizes that the dice screwed you and he wants to help you fix the situation. Or not. YMMV.

 

[payn]

This has been turning over in my head and I've been wondering how many times the characters in question have a back up plan. An answer to "What happens if I get caught?" When you have to run away, how many times do players say something like "I toss a bag of caltrops/marbles behind me as I run" or "I throw a smoke stick at my feet and flee"? I know this advice is going to vary from table to table, but in my experience saying something like that tends to tip things in your favor when escaping. Because the DM recognizes that the dice screwed you and he wants to help you fix the situation. Or not. YMMV.

I think this is one of those elements for groups that stick to what's on the character sheet and those who go beyond. Playstyle is really going to decide this kind of thing.

 

[Maxperson]

Knowing when to retreat can be a problem, but does not need to be one. The DM is the window between the characters who are experiencing the world and the players. There's a lot of information that is often glossed over but is very useful for that sort of thing.

"The giant humanoid swings at you with a two handed axe, hitting for 14 points of damage."
vs.
"The giant humanoid swings negligently at you, almost losing grip on the two handed axe with it's poor form - but that is still enough to easily penetrate your armor. Luckily this hit was light for such a massive weapon, only doing 14 points of damage."

I don't roll in front of them, but I will convey that information to them in the description.

When playing in person I prefer to roll in front of my players - when they are getting hit on a 6 on the die, and I'm rolling THAT many dice for damage, it gives them information their their character could be able to tell. My players have been told it is not meta-gaming to act on that, I am doing it on purpose. I also still use "bloodied" (or "staggered") as a description of down to half HPs - while that mechanic isn't around in 5e, I figure any adventurer should be able to tell if an opponent they are fighting is above or below half health.

Bloodied is in 5e sort of. Nothing keys off of it, but when describing hit point damage 5e says this.

"When you current hit point total is half or more of your hit point maximum, you typically show no signs of injury. When you drop below half your hit point maximum you show signs of wear, such as cuts and bruises."

My big issue with running away is that PCs typically move at a speed of 30 and many, if not most monsters are faster than you are, so if you run, it just catches you and attacks you again.