Savage Species - 1 HD ECLs (error ? )

[BryonD]

You are correct, BryonD--it is an error.

A high-elf barbarian 1 is ECL 1.

Thanks.

I was starting to think I was either insane or had lost the ability to do basic addition.

 

[Knight Otu]

Correct. And a classed High Elf has 0 Humanoid Hit Dice and a level adjustment of 0 for an ECL of 0. Table 2-2 lists the ECL as 1.

In this case, it has a class level.



Or maybe I'm thinking at a too late time...

 

[BryonD]

In this case, it has a class level.

When would it not?

Even the MM elf is assumed to be a warrior 1.

Or maybe I'm thinking at a too late time...

LOL

 

[Darkness]

Moved to Rules...

And I think that if you just go by HD (which are dropped for such characters) and level adjustment rather than the total ECL, the chart works.
I agree that they did it a bit more complicated than was necessary, though.

 

[Spatula]

The table isn't amazingly clear, but the text mentions several times that 1 HD humanoids lose their "racial HD" (really a warrior level in most cases although SS doesn't mention this that I've seen) and replace it with the first class level. The basic races have a level adjustment of +0, so it all works out. The more powerful 1 HD humanoid races have +1 or higher level adjustments.

 

[BryonD]

The table isn't amazingly clear, but the text mentions several times that 1 HD humanoids lose their "racial HD" (really a warrior level in most cases although SS doesn't mention this that I've seen) and replace it with the first class level. The basic races have a level adjustment of +0, so it all works out. The more powerful 1 HD humanoid races have +1 or higher level adjustments.

Right, so you subtract 1 from the ECLs of the 1 HD creatures. Whether it is high elf, which should be 0 not 1, or drow, which should be 2 not 3.

 

[Darmyth]

ECL= # of Hit Dice + Level Adjustment
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bugbear ECL = 3 Hit Dice + 1 Level Adjustment = 4

High Elf (no class) = 1 Hit Die (racial) + 0 Level Adjustment = 1

High Elf Barbarian (example) = 1 Hit Die (replace racial HD w/ class HD) + 0 Level Adjustment = 1

Dark Elf (no class) = 1 Hit Die (racial) + 2 Level Adjustment = 3

Dark Elf Fighter (example) = 1 Hit Die (racial) + 2 Level Adjustment + 1 Hit Die (class) = 4

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You can only replace a Racial HD with a Class HD if the Race has *no* Level Adjustment.


So that is how it all works unless I'm not understanding your question/concerns. It's really not that bad or hard to figure out if ya spend a bit of time on it. I think it could have been made easier to understand but it's fine.

Problem I have is trying to breakdown monsters abilities per level of creatures that are not in the Appendix.

 

[hammymchamham]

Is anyone aware of any comment or errata regarding the tabulated ECLs for 1 HD creatures?

Their is a table early in the book which lists the High Elf as ECL 1, but the table in the back lists it as ECL 0. I'd go by the list at the end. I imagine this is something that will be fixed by the errata, as well as a few other errors.

 

[Darmyth]

actually the Table would be correct in that case. This is based off of the formula that they provided.

A character always have at least 1 HD, whether that's a racial HD or class HD, they always have at least 1. SO #HD (1) + #AD (0) = 1 ECL

 

[BryonD]

actually the Table would be correct in that case. This is based off of the formula that they provided.

A character always have at least 1 HD, whether that's a racial HD or class HD, they always have at least 1. SO #HD (1) + #AD (0) = 1 ECL

First, elves don't have even 1 racial hit die.

Second, the ECL formula presumes that you are using classes, so it is automatic that the 1 HD goes away. So the correct ECL remains #HD(0) + #AD(0) = 0 ECL.

Can you provide an example high elf char which includes an ECL of 1 just for being a high elf?