Scaling the Caster Classes Back

[ShadowX]

The thing is, wizards weren't really limited once they attained medium levels. It was only at low levels that the wizard ever has to worry about running out of spells. Yes they will always have limited numbers of their highest level spells, but since many spells scale, lower level spells are still quite potent and you have scrolls and wands. I would be very glad if they managed to balance classes at all levels.

 

[Irda Ranger]

Boris?

I thought I had a decent grasp of the various NPCs around.. Who is Boris?

Whoops. Typo, which is why you probably couldn't Google it. Borys of Ebe was "the Dragon" of Dark Sun, the only NPC to achieve 30th level in both Wizard and Psionicist. And this is AD&D 2e Psionics we're talking about, so you can imagine how balanced that was. He has also turned into a dragon.

PS: Could have left it at Elminster, since he pretty much pwns everybody

Yeah, even if Borys showed up, old Elminster can still play that "I'm the goddess of magic's lover" card. That beats anything.

 

[alaric]

I didn't know it was vitally important to "hardcore roleplayers" that their class be the "Biggest Badasses Around".

 

[Merlion]

I both hope and believe that the scaling back will be more of a spreading out, as some have mentioned. Having 30 levels to work in will, I think be a good thing.

I tend to think that the balance issues of wizards lie mainly in a few ill-designed spells here and there. I think overall we will see improvement in both the playability, balance, and concept of wizards at all levels. Based at least on what we know now.

 

[Remathilis]

I didn't know it was vitally important to "hardcore roleplayers" that their class be the "Biggest Badasses Around".

No one has delusions of mediocrity.

 

[William Ronald]

I both hope and believe that the scaling back will be more of a spreading out, as some have mentioned. Having 30 levels to work in will, I think be a good thing.

I tend to think that the balance issues of wizards lie mainly in a few ill-designed spells here and there. I think overall we will see improvement in both the playability, balance, and concept of wizards at all levels. Based at least on what we know now.

The design goal should be that all characters in a party have a chance to shine, and make a difference.

In one gaming group I was in, a wizard character was outclassed by a fighter/barbarian and a fighter/wizard because of equipment. (There were SEVERE balance issues in the group, which ultimately lead to my leaving it after many years.) No character should be a fifth wheel in a party of adventurers of roughly equivalent level. Every character should matter in some way.

 

[Merlion]

The design goal should be that all characters in a party have a chance to shine, and make a difference.

In one gaming group I was in, a wizard character was outclassed by a fighter/barbarian and a fighter/wizard because of equipment. (There were SEVERE balance issues in the group, which ultimately lead to my leaving it after many years.) No character should be a fifth wheel in a party of adventurers of roughly equivalent level. Every character should matter in some way.

Prexactly.

And i do think there is also a place for characters occasionally being in the anti-spotlight...for instance, high-SR type creatures for Wizards, or high DR creatures for fighter types etc.

But its when thats happening all the time, or when as you describe a character is alwats being outlcassed by other PCs, that we have problems.

 

[KarinsDad]

I didn't know it was vitally important to "hardcore roleplayers" that their class be the "Biggest Badasses Around".

It is if they are roleplaying the "biggest badass" role.

 

[Doug McCrae]

In almost every high fantasy setting -- I'm sure people can think of a few that are different, but basically, in almost every setting -- powerful wizards are The Biggest Badasses Around.

What works in fiction doesn't always work in rpgs. Rpgs need class balance.

 

[Dice4Hire]

Yeah, comparing fiction to the game does not work, unless you run a sole game.

In Wheel of Time Rand is THE MAN. Best sword fighter, best channeler (mage) and the most powerful person in the world. Makes for a nice story, but I would not want to play a 5-6 person game with another player being Rand. In fact I would not want to be Rand. Even the second person in the group would be a fifth wheel.

In a game there needs to be some kind of balance, real balance across all the levels. In 1E, or better, 2E, he wizard was terrible. One friggin spell at first level. What fun! Shine in the party for 6 seconds a day.

Now it is better, but the wizard needs to contribute at all levels, and not totally dominate at all elvels.

I still feel that the wizard will be more powerful at higher levels, especially outside of combat, if spells like teleport, scry and such are left in. But in combat they will not as much.