D&D 5E Sell me on the World of Greyhawk please

[Stacie GmrGrl]

What makes Greyhawk so good and popular? I didn't start playing D&D till 3rd edition came out and there wasn't a whole lot of Greyhawk at that time, or really any time in the last 15 years so I am hoping that some peoples will tell me and educate me as to why so many want to see this setting come back. So please tell me what's so good about it.

 

[SirAntoine]

Most of the big fans of Greyhawk love it for nostalgia. It was the first campaign setting for D&D, written by the game's co-creator, Gary Gygax, back in the 70's or early 80's. It's the setting where many of the classic adventures you'll hear about were set, but it originally had a very light footprint in the sense that it leaves the world open for the DM's of the world to use as they wish. You don't see novels advancing the story of the setting like you do in Forgotten Realms, and although the setting did undergo what I and other big fans regard as a complete shake-up in the early 90's, it's generally the same world from the beginning.

There are many countries on the map, and not many areas in between that are unclaimed. The characters and politics are quite believable for fantasy and D&D in general, and there is a raw tension in the air because you never know where the next threat will come from.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

Added on like half the world is controlled by evil empires and forces. As a result Evil is a stronger force then in most other settings.

 

[Jester David]

The world is more morally grey, as there are many evil empires and nations ruled by dicks.
There are tonnes of dungeons and ruins, as every part of the continent was ruled by two or three long fallen empires or claimed by a mad wizard.

But, mostly, there's a lot of sparse details. Some nations only received a couple paragraphs of detail, while others have a couple pages. As such, it's open to customization from DMs.
It's a world you can make your own without having to create your own map and history. Because so many nations are "evil" it's easy for players to take down the leaders, or claim territory in the empty patches, or otherwise make a difference in the world. So changes are almost encouraged.

 

[SirAntoine]

You can start the PC's in Keoland and that may be easiest and also most setting-neutral. More people can agree about what is going on there than say in Greyhawk, Furyondy, or Nyrond. Keoland has mostly stayed out of the major wars. If you want to trim back the evil lands, by far the easiest thing to do is take back the conquests of the Scarlet Brotherhood. Many disagree about whether they could have even taken place, because it was all of a sudden. So consider making independent the Hold of the Sea Princes, Onnwal, Idee, and the Lordship of the Isles.

I would keep the villains, though. They are pretty distinguished and fun to build stories around. The thing is, you never know where spies and assassins are. Even something like the Cult of Elemental Evil has spies. For instance, someone rich might move to a land much in need of new taxes and investment, and he gets in good with a local mayor. Then he builds a castle or temple to his chosen god, who is of course the most benign everyone recognizes, and underground he builds dungeons and secretly holds cult services there.

In Greyhawk, much of the adventure is like peeling an onion. There is a layer beneath, then another, and another. You are trying as much to "defeat the evildoers" as learn who they are and what their plans are, and of course, who they're working for, and how their plans connect to others. Well done, Greyhawk is by far the best setting for intrigues like this. The main villains are also terribly powerful, easily on par with the worst of the Forgotten Realms, so taking them down shouldn't be too easy if you know what I mean. (Save that for really high level, if at all.)

 

[Bupp]

I'd have to totally agree with all of the above. I started DMing in Greyhawk and ran many campaigns. Easy to plug in just about anything you want, and things are nebulous enough to make it your own.

 

[Staffan]

But, mostly, there's a lot of sparse details. Some nations only received a couple paragraphs of detail, while others have a couple pages. As such, it's open to customization from DMs.
It's a world you can make your own without having to create your own map and history. Because so many nations are "evil" it's easy for players to take down the leaders, or claim territory in the empty patches, or otherwise make a difference in the world. So changes are almost encouraged.

To be honest, that doesn't sound like a setting much in need of support.

 

[DMZ2112]

Stacie, it's worth noting that Greyhawk was the core setting of 3rd Edition. Nearly everything released by Wizards for 3rd Edition was set in Greyhawk unless it was specifically labeled Forgotten Realms or Eberron. If your dungeon master used published adventures (and you weren't playing in FR or Eberron), he was using Greyhawk material.

That may or may not help, but I felt it should be said.

To be honest, that doesn't sound like a setting much in need of support.

To be fair, Greyhawk is only on my list because of its historical significance to the genre, but none of the established settings need /support/. They've all had multiple hardbacks published in their canon. It would just be nice to have some new material /supported by them/, because most of them haven't been heard from in 16 years.

 

[Nergal Pendragon]

Stacie, it's worth noting that Greyhawk was the core setting of 3rd Edition. Nearly everything released by Wizards for 3rd Edition was set in Greyhawk unless it was specifically labeled Forgotten Realms or Eberron. If your dungeon master used published adventures (and you weren't playing in FR or Eberron), he was using Greyhawk material.

That may or may not help, but I felt it should be said.

This may also be a big selling point against Greyhawk. The way 3E handled it, it felt like an empty setting they honestly didn't care about and which had no real level of detail to give the players reason to really care about it. The 2E and 1E players in my group back then actually said it was probably the worst handling of the setting they've seen.

So, despite it being the default setting, I'm one of several players from back then who walked away knowing absolutely nothing about it.

Which kinda makes me leery about how 5E may treat FR.

 

[DMZ2112]

The 2E and 1E players in my group back then actually said it was probably the worst handling of the setting they've seen. So, despite it being the default setting, I'm one of several players from back then who walked away knowing absolutely nothing about it.

Oh, no doubt. But the material /was/ Greyhawk. Anyway, I don't know why that would be a point against the setting. It's why I think it should get some /relevant/ attention now. I have no such feelings about Eberron or Forgotten Realms, the other two D&D3 settings. They both got D&D3 and D&D4 treatments. They can both go swing.